AtomicMew wrote on Jul 14
th, 2011 at 10:45pm:
Mind posting what you wrote him here?
Message title: Crafting - Casuals, don't bother above level 35
I'm probably on the border between a casual and non-casual player.
Level 35 was where actively leveling a crafting character ended for me. With the current crafting mechanics, costs, and XP requirements, whatever levels I gain after this point will gained from deconstructing junk and crafting things I can use. I am up to level 40 now, having used up all of my ingredients filling a bag with useful shards for current and future character lives.
The ingredients cost was manageable to get to level 35, but the limitations on crafting cripple it apart from niche items. Race-restricted, BtA, and named items blow away most crafted material, apart from specialized melee weapons. Holy of ___ Bane lets you clean up content. Apart from people who spend all of their time in epics and raids at level 20, Holy Burst of Greater ___ Bane is not enough of an improvement to be worth the time and resources you need to spend in the crafting hall.
For a caster, crafting is absolutely pathetic. Appalling. Useless. Pointless. I can only make things like Superior Ardor V and Superior Erosion V. Superior VI clickies are level 60-70 in crafting, yet I could generally buy those by level 11 on every caster I run, for an affordable price. The only exception is Superior Brilliance V, which afaik, is only available through crafting. Level 90-ish to make Superior VII clickies when VIII drop in Amrath? Spell Pen VI is level 80, but the ones I loot are worthless on the AH.
I also would expect to be able to add metal-like properties to a weapon (silver, crystal, etc), even if it costs an arm and a leg or a bit of a grind. Make me turn in a dozen broccoli-type end rewards from quests, I really don't care how it is done, but until I can reasonably expect to turn a +1 mace into a Vicious Crystal Heavy Mace of Lesser Ooze bane (or handwraps), the potential of crafting remains unfulfilled. I refuse to roll a dark monk because I won't grind Shadow Crypt or Devil Assault until my eyes bleed. I am also never going to sink rare items like a large devil scale into crafting.
I can appreciate the need to balance between making crafting useful without making it overpowered, and between making crafting accessible without making it trivial. The game depends on hamster wheels - the basic ones (XP, leveling to 20), and the optional ones (raid gear, greensteel and Cannith crafting). I don't think all of the issues above (adding silver/crystal, adding a set bonus, and making useful items available to casual players) can be addressed in Cannith crafting in its current form without accelerating power creep.
At first, I thought that crafting could help level out the huge difference between new and old characters, but the way it is set up right now, it is doing the opposite - making the gap even bigger. Sure, your TR who is dripping with raid gear and greensteel is going to outperform any 28 point in the Sands, but with crafted gear and careful play, the 28 pointer should still be able to feel like they're contributing to the group. Sadly, they cannnot, and that is not fun for newbies. We need those people to stay in the game, and Cannith Crafting is not going to do that. Which raises the question - who is crafting here to benefit?
A first life is not going to hit crafting level 35 by level 11. As long as I can easily pull BtA ML5 +3 Str gloves from Tangleroot (Blademaster Gauntlets), who cares if someone can easily craft some BtC ML7 +3 stat items on their first character? As long as Red Fens sets are stupidly overpowered compared to ML7 loot from four years ago, who cares if a newbies first character can make a flaming of pure good by level 9? Or a Superior / Greater IV clickie?
I really think crafting should level out the game rather than inducing more power creep. I'd rather use masterwork weapons all the way to 20 than see the Monty Haul get worse (have you LOOKED at the Staff of Fleshshaping? It is far better than raid loot).
I leveled up using weapons and gear that were one or two steps behind the best - +5 wisdom ring of repair +3 at level 13 instead of a clean +6 wisdom ring. It would be nice if crafting allowed people to make items that are not ideal, but are one step down for the level. For a first life character to craft something rare like a ML11 Race restricted +6 stat item would be overpowered. However, I see no reason to prevent them from making a ML13 +5 item by requiring so much time, XP, and resources to grind out crafting levels.
Perhaps that might be a way for crafting levels to work - anyone can craft decent gear for their character level with a little effort, but only those with experience can match good random loot, and only the top tier of crafting XP could match the best race restricted random loot, named items, or raid gear?
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Madfloyd asking for "constructive input" re: Craft (Read 7126 times)
