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Very Hot Topic (More than 75 Replies) Why GW2 is better than DDO (Read 195744 times)
Cale
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #550 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 7:53am
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Chris79 wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 7:24am:
I'm not sure about this Cale - I watch the duelist move into position when you summon him out of range. Do you mean once he stops moving he doesn't move anymore - cos that I'm not sure of, new to mesmer and all.

Yeah, once he's in position he stays there.  If he draws aggro and the mob runs up to punch him in the face, he stays there, takes it, and usually dies.

Try the Swordsman and watch him work against a stationary mob.  Then watch him work against a mobile mob.
They do similar damage, but the swordsman will survive longer than the Duelist because of his AI.  You can summon him from 1200.  He attacks, then leaps back to about 300.  His leap in works like Spring Attack, where he jumps in (range of about 500), attacks, then jumps back out.  If the mob moves out of his leap range, he moves to stay at the edge of that range.  During his leap in he's evading.  If the mob moves too close, he leaps back out of melee range.
He only does slightly less overall damage than the Duelist due to a higher attack rate, but survives much longer because of his AI, so on paper the Duelist is better, but in play the Swordsman will usually do more damage.
The only time I think the Duelist is better is against hard hitting mobs (bosses, Exp dungeons, etc) and even then it's a wash because you lose that second block (on a 15s cd).
Between Blurred Frenzy on a 8-10s cd, Illusionary Riposte on a 12-15s cd, and your dodges, dual sword Mes is extremely survivable in melee for a light armor profession once you get the hang of using the skills properly.

edit:
The swordsman also works better for shatter builds because he stays at a fairly consistent range of 300-500 from the target at all times, so while the duelist might have to run a marathon to shatter the swordsman never will.
« Last Edit: Dec 27th, 2012 at 8:15am by Cale »  

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Aqualung
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #551 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 10:41am
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My Norn Mesmer is almost level 70 now and I swap from greatsword to dual wield swords. I do have scepter, pistol and focus as secondaries, but only use them occasionally.


I hit berserker and swordsman from greatsword as I am running in, switch to dual swords and hit swordsman again and then enter melee. That seems to work best for me. For tougher veteran and champion fights, I will stay with the greatsword and keep cycling the clones and the snow worm summons.
  
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rev Jim
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #552 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 11:47am
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Can you dual wield shields in GW2?
  


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stainer
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #553 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:05pm
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rev Jim wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 11:47am:
Can you dual wield shields in GW2?


No. It won't let you dual wield two purely off hand items.
  

Nilazgrc: For all those familiar with loreseekers/sentinels.... Dont run with Stainer.... Guy is a tool. Black list his toons.
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Gawna
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #554 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:15pm
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stainer wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:05pm:
No. It won't let you dual wield two purely off hand items.

You know what you can wield in your off hand?
  
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Eladiun
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #555 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:22pm
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I see this shit all the time and it's virtually impossible to dual wield two full sized shield in real life so why should it be possible in any game.
  

Nevynn wrote on Nov 18th, 2010 at 11:38pm:
Anybody coming to this board expecting anything more sophisticated than a dick joke had better get used to disappointment.


Calvet wrote on Oct 20th, 2011 at 12:18pm:
I just got that impression after you spent 13 pages calling out eladiun for being an interwebs bully when anyone who's been posting on here already knew that.  I mean, he's proud of it and hardly tries to hide that at all.


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stainer
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #556 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:49pm
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Quote:
You know what you can wield in your off hand?


Your nuts?

What would I be doing with my primary hand?

- we can take this to pm if it gets real racy.
  

Nilazgrc: For all those familiar with loreseekers/sentinels.... Dont run with Stainer.... Guy is a tool. Black list his toons.
kmack can drive the tractor.
The Vault donates to charity.
JDollar wrote on Apr 25th, 2013 at 4:47pm:
Stainer likes tractors
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #557 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:59pm
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Eladiun wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:22pm:
I see this shit all the time and it's virtually impossible to dual wield two full sized shield in real life so why should it be possible in any game.


Because it's a game and real life should not be brought into it...

Because I want to try to flap my arms with them equiped and try to fly...

Because....well just because....
  
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #558 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 1:19pm
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stainer wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:49pm:
Your nuts?

What would I be doing with my primary hand?

- we can take this to pm if it gets real racy.


please dont i was tole i need to find new fap material today... this might be suitable
  

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notajedi wrote on Mar 14th, 2013 at 6:47pm:
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JDollar
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #559 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 1:20pm
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Eladiun wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:22pm:
I see this shit all the time and it's virtually impossible to dual wield two full sized shield in real life so why should it be possible in any game.


I have 2 replica shields i could dual wield the shit out of them
  

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J$ can take great pride that I think he's too revolting for words and will probably post "gtg cat on fire" if he joins a group I'm in.

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JD is easily the most genuinely mean person I've known

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notajedi wrote on Mar 14th, 2013 at 6:47pm:
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popejubal
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #560 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 1:41pm
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Eladiun wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:22pm:
I see this shit all the time and it's virtually impossible to dual wield two full sized shield in real life so why should it be possible in any game.


I'm exactly as capable of dual wielding shields as I am of dual wielding swords in real life.  And I don't even have magic weapons (other than my penis).
  

fnord
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JDollar
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #561 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 1:58pm
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popejubal wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 1:41pm:
  And I don't even have magic weapons (other than my penis).


No oversized weapon penalty on that badboy
  

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J$ can take great pride that I think he's too revolting for words and will probably post "gtg cat on fire" if he joins a group I'm in.

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notajedi wrote on Mar 14th, 2013 at 6:47pm:
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Eladiun
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #562 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:04pm
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Flint wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:59pm:
Because it's a game and real life should not be brought into it...


I disagree.  Even in games realistic combat and physics are important to the overall immersion.

JDollar wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 1:20pm:
I have 2 replica shields i could dual wield the shit out of them


I doubt it. In a combat situation two shields would be more of a liability than a useful asset.  Too susceptible to tangling on each other.

  

Nevynn wrote on Nov 18th, 2010 at 11:38pm:
Anybody coming to this board expecting anything more sophisticated than a dick joke had better get used to disappointment.


Calvet wrote on Oct 20th, 2011 at 12:18pm:
I just got that impression after you spent 13 pages calling out eladiun for being an interwebs bully when anyone who's been posting on here already knew that.  I mean, he's proud of it and hardly tries to hide that at all.


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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #563 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:12pm
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Eladiun wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:04pm:
I disagree.  Even in games realistic combat and physics are important to the overall immersion.


I doubt it. In a combat situation two shields would be more of a liability than a useful asset.  Too susceptible to tangling on each other.


nope, think spartan shield/heater shield. you would hold one in tight and use the edge of the other for striking. You think two shields are more cumbersome than a 8-10 ft spear (pole arm)/shield combo. Less effective for sure but entirely possible. Ofcourse the 1 on 1 combat we are used to is not what it was like in historical battle. Having the most effective killing weapon was primary concern defense was secondary.
  

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J$ can take great pride that I think he's too revolting for words and will probably post "gtg cat on fire" if he joins a group I'm in.

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SNAP!  Point for the Canadian!
notajedi wrote on Mar 14th, 2013 at 6:47pm:
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Eladiun
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #564 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:20pm
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JDollar wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:12pm:
Having the most effective killing weapon was primary concern defense was secondary.


Exactly, it was about killing your opponent quickly before you tired out.  Exhausting an opponent using two shields would be easy.  Not that it's realistic but as kids we used to sword fight with foam rubber or whiffle ball bats and trash can lids or such.  Once an opponent lost their sword, it was rather easy drop.  A shield is just a giant target to hit with no sword.  Even with two shield you will have huge issues with reach.
 
JDollar wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:12pm:
You think two shields are more cumbersome than a 8-10 ft spear (pole arm)/shield combo.


Pole arms were generally used vs mounted opponents where the extra reach was important for survival or building a spear wall would break a charge.
« Last Edit: Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:21pm by Eladiun »  

Nevynn wrote on Nov 18th, 2010 at 11:38pm:
Anybody coming to this board expecting anything more sophisticated than a dick joke had better get used to disappointment.


Calvet wrote on Oct 20th, 2011 at 12:18pm:
I just got that impression after you spent 13 pages calling out eladiun for being an interwebs bully when anyone who's been posting on here already knew that.  I mean, he's proud of it and hardly tries to hide that at all.


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JDollar
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #565 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:39pm
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Eladiun wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:20pm:
Exactly, it was about killing your opponent quickly before you tired out.  Exhausting an opponent using two shields would be easy.  Not that it's realistic but as kids we used to sword fight with foam rubber or whiffle ball bats and trash can lids or such.  Once an opponent lost their sword, it was rather easy drop.  A shield is just a giant target to hit with no sword.  Even with two shield you will have huge issues with reach.
 

Pole arms were generally used vs mounted opponents where the extra reach was important for survival or building a spear wall would break a charge.


so... you are agreeing then dual wielding shields totally possible?

edit also, one of the most effective sword shield combos in history was the gladious and roman shield, not much reach there.
« Last Edit: Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:47pm by JDollar »  

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J$ can take great pride that I think he's too revolting for words and will probably post "gtg cat on fire" if he joins a group I'm in.

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SNAP!  Point for the Canadian!
notajedi wrote on Mar 14th, 2013 at 6:47pm:
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Eladiun
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #566 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:45pm
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JDollar wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:39pm:
so... you are agreeing then dual wielding shields totally possible?



Not as a viable battlefield tactic...  you certainly can strap on to each arm and be a training dummy.  Maneuvering and Fighting with a heater shield on each arm...not really.
« Last Edit: Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:46pm by Eladiun »  

Nevynn wrote on Nov 18th, 2010 at 11:38pm:
Anybody coming to this board expecting anything more sophisticated than a dick joke had better get used to disappointment.


Calvet wrote on Oct 20th, 2011 at 12:18pm:
I just got that impression after you spent 13 pages calling out eladiun for being an interwebs bully when anyone who's been posting on here already knew that.  I mean, he's proud of it and hardly tries to hide that at all.


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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #567 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 4:07pm
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Eladiun wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 2:45pm:
Not as a viable battlefield tactic...  you certainly can strap on to each arm and be a training dummy.  Maneuvering and Fighting with a heater shield on each arm...not really.


I would be willing to try it. In a 1 on 1 situation simply turtling up while an opponent wails away with a sword will tire themselves out more quickly than absorbing/deflecting the impacts will. Further to that such an opponent might easily under estimate the offensive capability of a shield while at the same time become over confident in their ability to do damage that combined with fatigue would open up opportunities for effect counter attack.
  

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J$ can take great pride that I think he's too revolting for words and will probably post "gtg cat on fire" if he joins a group I'm in.

Quote:
JD is easily the most genuinely mean person I've known

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SNAP!  Point for the Canadian!
notajedi wrote on Mar 14th, 2013 at 6:47pm:
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Eladiun
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #568 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 4:18pm
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JDollar wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 4:07pm:
I would be willing to try it. In a 1 on 1 situation simply turtling up while an opponent wails away with a sword will tire themselves out more quickly than absorbing/deflecting the impacts will. Further to that such an opponent might easily under estimate the offensive capability of a shield while at the same time become over confident in their ability to do damage that combined with fatigue would open up opportunities for effect counter attack.



The thing is you really just can't turtle. A heater shield is only 20-24" tall which leaves lots of exposed areas.  Strikes would be aimed above and below the shield as simple thrusts or swipes.  The opponent would keep flanking forcing you to turn with them while jabbing at exposed areas.  Any forward thrust to close to attack range could be side stepped or back stepped.
« Last Edit: Dec 27th, 2012 at 4:21pm by Eladiun »  

Nevynn wrote on Nov 18th, 2010 at 11:38pm:
Anybody coming to this board expecting anything more sophisticated than a dick joke had better get used to disappointment.


Calvet wrote on Oct 20th, 2011 at 12:18pm:
I just got that impression after you spent 13 pages calling out eladiun for being an interwebs bully when anyone who's been posting on here already knew that.  I mean, he's proud of it and hardly tries to hide that at all.


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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #569 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 4:50pm
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Two shields is stupid and does not work.

From a LARP perspective...

The nature of it being strapped to your arm or being wielded from the center limits your range too much to be an effective weapon except for close-in situations. If you limit your range completely by using two shields all you are doing is giving your opponent free shots before you can even close the distance.

Now of your two attacks, bashing with the face of the shield bash is an effective way of pushing an opponent off of you and into range of your primary weapon. You will not have the range to strike with a second shield.

An edge hit will still work, but it still has a tiny range and leaves your arm exposed. With limited danger posed by your other shield you will lose that arm, especially if you and your opponent are right-handed (or both left).


From a real-life(tm) perspective...

If you turtle behind your shield(s) for long, it will break, and you will die. They aren't indestructible like they are in games.
  
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #570 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 5:05pm
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JDollar wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 1:58pm:
No oversized weapon penalty on that badboy


That's right.  It's a special trait on my penis that I don't take any penalties on it even though it goes to 11.

(centimeters count, right?)
« Last Edit: Dec 27th, 2012 at 7:15pm by popejubal »  

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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #571 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 5:33pm
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stainer wrote on Dec 27th, 2012 at 12:49pm:
What would I be doing with my primary hand?

- we can take this to pm if it gets real racy.

You don't need both hands for my boobs, obv.
  
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #572 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 7:15pm
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You don't need both hands for my boobs, obv.


Good thing, too.  If we did, then we wouldn't have any thumbs available for other requirements.
  

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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #573 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 10:13pm
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So... which part of reality are we using here... LARP? lol I give up if larpers say its impossible remember kids the arguement is not is it practical, or will it guarantee victory, or even better protection, its whether dual shields is possible> Since we are appealing to LARPing as an authority I will appeal to the DUngeons and Dragons Cartoon of the 80's Eric the Paladin only used a shield, he could have totally done his thing with two shields!!!!

Also if anyone is still reading, the fact that we ( 3 or 4 people who actively play DDO) are arguing about using two shields in a fight makes DDO the better game, you are not going to find this anywhere else.
  

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J$ can take great pride that I think he's too revolting for words and will probably post "gtg cat on fire" if he joins a group I'm in.

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JD is easily the most genuinely mean person I've known

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SNAP!  Point for the Canadian!
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Re: Why GW2 is better than DDO
Reply #574 - Dec 27th, 2012 at 10:50pm
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I will LARP you so hard JonnyD.
  
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