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This explains a lot (Read 21539 times)

karatekid Self-Proclaimed Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 4830 Joined: Aug 13^th, 2012	Re: This explains a lot Reply #50 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 4:56pm	Print Post
	Terebinthia wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 3:35pm: Yeah, this. I'm not a coder but I worked as a PM / business analyst / UAT manager for a long time in a Financial services environment. I just can't grasp why they can't mirror live. To me it's a basic. I understand nasty spaghetti code exists, but... I don't get how this kind of version control isn't mandatory. I know it's not people's money, but still. There's so many products out there... I am having a very similar discussion at this very moment at work (cmd-tab is my friend)... problem is you nailed it... UAT is getting to be non-existent any more. SIT to make sure nothing pukes, then go-live. I'm on a call right now sounding so "get off my lawn" arguing for UAT testing.


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karatekid Self-Proclaimed Puppy Farmer Offline Posts: 4830 Joined: Aug 13^th, 2012	Re: This explains a lot Reply #51 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:02pm	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 4:50pm: You're delusional. I worked for Time Warner for 12 years. I was with Warner, then Time/Warner and then AOL/TimeWarner. The stock split like 50 times and I was 100% in Warner stock. I bought a house from it. Do you know why the stock was worth so much? You don't get to Fortune 500 by buying everyone double of everything, you retard. You get to Fortune 500 by maximizing profits which has nothing to do with making sure everything works. And you get on the cover of the Wall St Journal when your tech shits the bed and data is compromised. Has nothing to do with Turbine - just reflected rant from the other conversation I'm having.


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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #52 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:04pm	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 4:50pm: You're delusional. I worked for Time Warner for 12 years. I was with Warner, then Time/Warner and then AOL/TimeWarner. The stock split like 50 times and I was 100% in Warner stock. I bought a house from it. Do you know why the stock was worth so much? You don't get to Fortune 500 by buying everyone double of everything, you retard. You get to Fortune 500 by maximizing profits. Are you really going to say that your experience has any relation to what goes on over at WB Interactive or Turbine (a separate company until 2 years ago)? That would be like saying someone at NBC has a clue how they run things over at GE Lighting or Aircraft Engines. Or better yet, Penske. A GE Subsidiary that is run under a different management umbrella. Sure maximizing profits is how any business is successful, but you maximize profits by taking calculated risks, not foolish ones. Not allocating some resources to testing and version control would be a foolish risk.


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Gunga Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Fuck You. Posts: 9362 Location: New Jersey Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #53 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:22pm	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:04pm: Are you really going to say that your experience has any relation to what goes on over at WB Interactive or Turbine (a separate company until 2 years ago)?� That would be like saying someone at NBC has a clue how they run things over at GE Lighting or Aircraft Engines.� Or better yet, Penske.� A GE Subsidiary that is run under a different management umbrella. You're taking a baby step towards the great level of my executive understanding in the matter. I'm not sure if I'd be better off just letting you talk your way into finally getting there or ridiculing you. Probably a little of both. Your analogies are like a peanutbutter cock fucking a huge-titted fried chicken. They are delicious yet have nothing to do with what I'm talking about. Quote: Sure maximizing profits is how any business is successful, but you maximize profits by taking calculated risks, not foolish ones.� Not allocating some resources to testing and version control would be a foolish risk.� Some. Not 2x total hardware, software and maintenance budget.
	« Last Edit: Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:23pm by Gunga »
	Smrti wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2013 at 3:00pm: Gunga is the best.
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scraap Ex Member	Re: This explains a lot Reply #54 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:26pm	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:22pm: Some. Not 2x total hardware, software and maintenance budget. U18, Mounlands, Lam, 8 Live servers. Sure you want to bang on the notion that adding an additional server to that chain for debug analysis would be 2x the maintenance cost?
	« Last Edit: Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:30pm by »

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GermanicusMaximus Dragon Raider Offline Thou shalt have no other trolls before me. Posts: 294 Joined: Feb 19^th, 2013 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #55 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:37pm	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 4:25pm: This. Hardware costs, yo. It is fun to watch the mouthbreathers apply their extensive knowledge of how the fries station works to all aspects of technology and science, though. I love these forums. Where else could I get 1) someone who admits he knows nothing about the topic at hand 2) has a pic of himself staring at a bunch of cocks which are tantalizingly out of reach accusing other people of being fry cooks?

	Family, Country, and the US stock market. Although, in a pinch, any convertible currency or liquid asset will do. Yobai wrote on Jun 18^th, 2014 at 6:15pm: I would rather give Thrudh a rim job. Bigjunk wrote on Nov 2^nd, 2014 at 12:21pm: That is some masterful trolling.
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Gunga Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Fuck You. Posts: 9362 Location: New Jersey Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #56 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:14pm	Print Post
	Quote: U18, Mounlands, Lam. Sure you want to bang on the notion that adding a 4th server to that chain for debug analysis would be 2x the maintenance cost? If they are only using 1 server now, but need another for a test environment, that would be two (or 2x). If they have piece of hardware for each server world, and need another for an identical test world, that would be a 14% increase to hardware and maintenance per year, every year. If they make the investment on a particularly good year, they may skip it the next year especially if they are trying to trim down to show profitability to a prospective buyer. Redundant facility costs are exactly double hardware costs, and I don't personally know of any small-midsized production companies that build redundant infrastructure. In my experience with Warner, testing scenarios were done with older, smaller or limited versions of the live service, often utilizing outdated technology. I have had personal experience with QC units required to meet federal compliance guidelines more recently; they are expensive and need to produce some serious value or they too are the first numbers crossed out at budget meetings.

	Smrti wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2013 at 3:00pm: Gunga is the best.
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Gunga Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Fuck You. Posts: 9362 Location: New Jersey Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #57 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:16pm	Print Post
	GermanicusMaximus wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:37pm: I love these forums. Where else could I get 1) someone who admits he knows nothing about the topic at hand 2) has a pic of himself staring at a bunch of cocks which are� tantalizingly out of reach accusing other people of being fry cooks? Can you drive a car like a pro but not be able to adjust the timing, cuntmouth? I can.

	Smrti wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2013 at 3:00pm: Gunga is the best.
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Terebinthia Horoluth Raider Offline All your cupcakes are belong to me! :D Posts: 2499 Joined: Jan 6^th, 2011	Re: This explains a lot Reply #58 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:26pm	Print Post
	Flav wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 4:20pm: Fucking hardware cost... I have what I think is an accurate idea of infrastructure involved in the Live server.... Lets just say that : - 1 Oracle Cluster ( 2 powerful nodes at least ) - 1 EMC� Symetrix ( to hold the several terabytes of data ) - 1 SAN Infrastructure ( to connect the Symetrix to the Oracle Cluster and the Game Cluster ) - 1 Load Balancer for the Oracle Cluster - 1 dedicated back end network infrastructure ( Gigagyte net, probably fiber) - 1 Game Cluster ( around 100/200 blades, probably more ) - 1 Billing/accounting/authentication cluster ( several nodes .... 5/6 as it's common infrastructure ) - 1 Load Balancer infrastructure for the game server. - 1 Front End Network ( common to all the servers ) Should be IMFO representative of what we call one single game server. ( say G-Land ) The number of blades in thee Game Cluster can be dynamically allocated to another server if needed... Eventually the Symetrix can be shared if they went for a big one, but it add complexity at the SAN and back end network. not many companies can waste several hundred thousand dollars ( or euros ) for a test system. And the few that can ( and do )� are usually way bigger than Turbine. ( lets say : in Telco : ATT, Verizon, BT, FT, DT, Telia, Vodafone, ... Ericsson, Alcatel-Lucent, Nokia-Siemens, Huawei, ZTE, ... HP, IBM, Oracle, SAP, ... ) Do you really need all of that stuff? Seriously. Not trying to be an arsehole, just my business background of course is from the school of of course you have something to test live on. And there's still hilarity to telll. Am I missing something in the software industry here? (obviously capriciously losing your digital stuff in a videogame is a degree smaller than a FS company going tits up, but don't you build a test system in as a basic? (I think I need to accept I don't know this world and shut up. But I am still in bafflement). If nothing else wouldn't you want the mirror system to blow up the exploits? Help me out here....


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Gawna Ex Member	Re: This explains a lot Reply #59 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:29pm	Print Post
	We have our ISO audit next month. I come here to get away from my reality and you people talking about version control are stressing me out.


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Maxwell Edison Bailiff Offline HADOUKEN! Posts: 3142 Location: Bologna Joined: Jul 13^th, 2011	Re: This explains a lot Reply #60 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:33pm	Print Post
	ISO to me is a baseball stat about extra base hits.

	� ��
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Gunga Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Fuck You. Posts: 9362 Location: New Jersey Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #61 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:34pm	Print Post
	Terebinthia wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:26pm: my business background of course is from the school of of course you have something to test live on

	Smrti wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2013 at 3:00pm: Gunga is the best.
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JDollar Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Swarthy as fuck Posts: 5380 Location: Uttering "death threats"! Joined: Jun 24^th, 2011 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #62 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:58pm	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:22pm: Your analogies are like a peanutbutter cock fucking a huge-titted fried chicken. This is part of why we are friends

	Quote: J$ can take great pride that I think he's too revolting for words and will probably post "gtg cat on fire" if he joins a group I'm in. Quote: JD is easily the most genuinely mean person I've known Quote: SNAP!� Point for the Canadian! notajedi wrote on Mar 14^th, 2013 at 6:47pm: JonnyD has had way better exploits.
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scraap Ex Member	Re: This explains a lot Reply #63 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 7:14pm	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:14pm: If they are only using 1 server now, but need another for a test environment, that would be two (or 2x). If they have piece of hardware for each server world, and need another for an identical test world, that would be a 14% increase to hardware and maintenance per year, every year. If they make the investment on a particularly good year, they may skip it the next year especially if they are trying to trim down to show profitability to a prospective buyer. Redundant facility costs are exactly double hardware costs, and I don't personally know of any small-midsized production companies that build redundant infrastructure. In my experience with Warner, testing scenarios were done with older, smaller or limited versions of the live service, often utilizing outdated technology. I have had personal experience with QC units required to meet federal compliance guidelines more recently; they are expensive and need to produce some serious value or they too are the first numbers crossed out at budget meetings. I'd actually bump it up to 20% for additional instrumentation (and nice round numbers for the bean-cunters). So 12 bucks a month instead of 10, killing off a redundant server part of the time like ML or Lam for part of the day, or starting a telethon. I'm thinkin DDO:Jerrys Kids.


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Terebinthia Horoluth Raider Offline All your cupcakes are belong to me! :D Posts: 2499 Joined: Jan 6^th, 2011	Re: This explains a lot Reply #64 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 7:17pm	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:34pm: http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm233/gungah/a98196_fb-grammar_1-dad_zpsc8900... What, you want your banking systems not to be able to replicate live? Douchebutter


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stainer Arkat's Bitch Offline Gawna's big sexy crony! Posts: 12345 Location: gawna's nuts Joined: Jan 28^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #65 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 7:18pm	Print Post
	I think we can all agree that whatever processes Turbine are using currently do not work very well.

	Nilazgrc: For all those familiar with loreseekers/sentinels.... Dont run with Stainer.... Guy is a tool. Black list his toons. kmack can drive the tractor. The Vault donates to charity. JDollar wrote on Apr 25^th, 2013 at 4:47pm: Stainer likes tractors
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Turkantho Ex Member	Re: This explains a lot Reply #66 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 7:30pm	Print Post
	fuck, stainer stop that deescalation and diplomacy shit things were getting interesting in here!


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stainer Arkat's Bitch Offline Gawna's big sexy crony! Posts: 12345 Location: gawna's nuts Joined: Jan 28^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #67 - Mar 12^th, 2013 at 7:31pm	Print Post
	Quote: fuck, stainer stop that deescalation and diplomacy shit things were getting interesting in here! We can throw around solutions all day, it isn't like Turbine is going to do anything to improve the situation. It is like telling congress to quit spending money.
	« Last Edit: Mar 12^th, 2013 at 8:54pm by stainer »
	Nilazgrc: For all those familiar with loreseekers/sentinels.... Dont run with Stainer.... Guy is a tool. Black list his toons. kmack can drive the tractor. The Vault donates to charity. JDollar wrote on Apr 25^th, 2013 at 4:47pm: Stainer likes tractors
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Bill Z Bubb Boobies Controller Offline I only know three chords! Posts: 1238 Joined: Jul 2^nd, 2012	Re: This explains a lot Reply #68 - Mar 13^th, 2013 at 12:09am	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 5:22pm: You're taking a baby step towards the great level of my executive understanding in the matter. How was that Holiday Inn you stayed at last night?

	� ��
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Eladiun Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Two Time Loser Posts: 8398 Location: Rhode Island, USA Joined: Jun 17^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #69 - Mar 13^th, 2013 at 12:13am	Print Post
	Gunga wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 4:51pm: Ah, you've caught me. I admitted that I don't know a lot about something that I've admitted I don't know a lot about. You're a retard, but I like you. Editting ones post doesn't change the original quoted content sunshine. Stainer please don't hack my company...waaawaaa... LOL, you're a joke.

	Nevynn wrote on Nov 18^th, 2010 at 11:38pm: Anybody coming to this board expecting anything more sophisticated than a dick joke had better get used to disappointment. Calvet wrote on Oct 20^th, 2011 at 12:18pm: I just got that impression after you spent 13 pages calling out eladiun for being an interwebs bully when anyone who's been posting on here already knew that.� I mean, he's proud of it and hardly tries to hide that at all. Quote: Eladiun is an awful person
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Gunga Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Fuck You. Posts: 9362 Location: New Jersey Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #70 - Mar 13^th, 2013 at 8:40am	Print Post
	Eladiun wrote on Mar 13^th, 2013 at 12:13am: Editting ones post doesn't change the original quoted content sunshine.� Stainer please don't hack my company...waaawaaa...� LOL, you're a joke. DDO is hard.

	Smrti wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2013 at 3:00pm: Gunga is the best.
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Mokune Shroud Slacker Offline Gimped Hairless Ape Posts: 1115 Joined: Nov 16^th, 2011	Re: This explains a lot Reply #71 - Mar 13^th, 2013 at 9:54am	Print Post
	I'll take one Load Balancer with a side order of Peanut Butter Oracle Clusters....Hold the Fried Chicken (Triglycerides and greasy sheets yah know)
	« Last Edit: Mar 13^th, 2013 at 9:55am by Mokune »
	Welcome to your sexually transmitted death sentence served in a shit-machine meat suit.
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Gunga Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Fuck You. Posts: 9362 Location: New Jersey Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #72 - Mar 13^th, 2013 at 10:08am	Print Post
	JDollar wrote on Mar 12^th, 2013 at 6:58pm: This is part of why we are friends And all this time I thought it was the gentle nut-cupping.

	Smrti wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2013 at 3:00pm: Gunga is the best.
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Luxgolg Shroud Slacker Offline So many bugs Posts: 1221 Location: Over there Joined: Oct 2^nd, 2012 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #73 - Mar 13^th, 2013 at 10:14am	Print Post
	I could tell this conversation got serious when the math came out... Less math, moar diagrams!

	Frog on all servers, but Cannith is home.
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Gunga Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline Fuck You. Posts: 9362 Location: New Jersey Joined: Aug 14^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: This explains a lot Reply #74 - Mar 13^th, 2013 at 10:24am	Print Post
	Luxgolg wrote on Mar 13^th, 2013 at 10:14am: Less math, moar diagrams!

	Smrti wrote on Mar 22^nd, 2013 at 3:00pm: Gunga is the best.
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