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Upcoming Quest XP Changes (Read 10302 times)

Darkrok Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1066 Joined: Nov 10^th, 2010 Gender:	Upcoming Quest XP Changes Jun 20^th, 2013 at 9:37am	Print Post
	Upcoming Quest XP Changes Quote: Very soon we�ll be opening Lamannia with the newest version of Enhancements. Included in that version of the game code are several new features and changes coming to quest XP in the expansion. We wanted to highlight what�s coming with a very early write up, because the changes that you�ll see on Lamannia are not yet ready for testing, and include a lot of place-holder numbers. Today we wanted to talk about the changes so that you have some insight into what features are coming: We�ve previously mentioned in our Reincarnation discussions that we�ll be reworking the XP curve to be less steep for 2nd and 3rd life reincarnations. Those curves will be ameliorated, so that the increase in XP needed to level isn�t such a drastic increase in the 15-20 range, and so that the lower level ranges require move XP to level. One of the other changes we are working on for the upcoming Expansion release is a change to the way quest repetition XP penalty works. Currently whenever you repeat the same quest over and over, the XP degrades until the quest permanently gives little to no XP. With the Expansion, we will allow the penalty to reset after a grace period, similar to the way chest loot ransack works. Next a new daily bonus is being added to quest completions. Every day, a quest will have a bonus added to the base XP value. Playing the quest on any difficulty level qualifies for this daily bonus. Finally, we will be adding a new way to receive bonus XP: Sagas. New NPCs will be arriving in Eberron and Faer�n who chronicle the deeds of heroes across multiple story archs/adventure packs. By completing all the quests in a given Saga, you can speak with the Saga NPC to claim an extra reward such as a large one-time XP grant, guild XP, or even tomes. The quality of those rewards can also be influenced by running the quests on higher difficulties. We are still refining what the final numbers will be for these changes and bonuses, and as we get closer to Expansion launch day we will go into greater detail. The version that will appear on Lamannia is not meant for testing, and is there merely because we have taken an early game build to continue Enhancements review with players. You�re welcome to provide feedback on what you see, but it is not something Lamannia participants should focus on because it is still a work in progress. We hope you�ve enjoyed this early look, as we�d like to continue these types of posts to let players peek behind the DM screen a bit more ahead of Shadowfell Conspiracy. - PurpleFooz

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Darkrok Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1066 Joined: Nov 10^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #1 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 9:38am	Print Post
	My response there: Quote: I'd heard that the 'ransacked' xp starts on the 3rd repetition. If that's the case would like to see that relaxed a bit. There are some short quests that I actually enjoy running more than that. Also, please make sure that, just like currently on live, the new 'ransacked' xp does not apply at cap (25 or 28 depending on when this goes live). There shouldn't be any xp degradation ever at cap...it just makes it harder to work on epic destinies. I definitely agree with some of the player comments about xp 'dead zones'. If you flatten the curve pay special attention to quests in the level range and doubly important quests that people actually enjoy running in the level range. Other than those issues I'm looking forward to these changes. It's definitely a step in the right direction.

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Flav Vault Frog Offline One Frog to Rule them All! Posts: 9989 Location: Land of the Frogs Joined: Aug 29^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #2 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 9:52am	Print Post
	It's 4th at the same difficulty... thus the NHEEE that was done long ago, or the EEEHHNC that is done nowadays. You do it 3 times at a given difficulty before the penalty hits. I haven't answered yet. Personally I would like to see the Retarded Streak go, and the old system brought back from the dead. ( if the quest is 5 level over your highest party member you get +50%, whatever the difficulty setting is... 1 Level +10% for a cap at +50% plus the first time bonus, and no [i] no death bonus[i] ) Now to work my suggestion would require a revision of all the XP given by quests. But IMHO it would do a lot of good to pugging, as people will want to group to get the highest quest level possible.

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Darkrok Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1066 Joined: Nov 10^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #3 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:04am	Print Post
	Flav wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 9:52am: It's 4th at the same difficulty... thus the NHEEE that was done long ago, or the EEEHHNC that is done nowadays. I'd heard some rumors that difficulty won't matter but that was in-game so god only knows what the person's source was. I like your ideas about running over-level quests giving a bonus...and the death penalty bonus really needs to DIAF just because it turns people into raging assholes and raging assholes into...well...they're still raging assholes.

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Flav Vault Frog Offline One Frog to Rule them All! Posts: 9989 Location: Land of the Frogs Joined: Aug 29^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #4 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:18am	Print Post
	Darkrok wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:04am: I like your ideas about running over-level quests giving a bonus... Well that's how it was in the begining. The Retarded Bonus came with F2P more or less. At that time VON3 with a party of Level 5 was XP jackpot, if you managed to complete it. The difficulty was managing to complete it.

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Darkrok Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1066 Joined: Nov 10^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #5 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:20am	Print Post
	Flav wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:18am: The difficulty was managing to complete it. And the fun. I don't see them going back but it would certainly be enjoyable if they did.

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bob the builder Abbot Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 772 Joined: Apr 19^th, 2011	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #6 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:27am	Print Post
	If the Underlevel bonus is added back along with the "ransack xp" mechanic added, I would think everyone would just use the same quests to get levelled. Everyone at level 1-2 would just Run Kobold's New Ringleader 9 times. Then move to Tangleroot... then to Deleras... then to Pit/Tear... then to Von3... then Crucible. Which is what they stopped, for the most part, from happening when they added the elite streak and took away the under-level bonus.


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Persiflage Abbot Raider Offline Posts: 974 Location: Khyber Joined: Jan 28^th, 2013	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #7 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:41am	Print Post
	bob the builder wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:27am: If the Underlevel bonus is added back along with the "ransack xp" mechanic added, I would think everyone would just use the same quests to get levelled. Eh, that depends on whether or not they come up with anything good for the Saga bonus. If you get a chunk of XP for running certain quests back-to-back without repetition, or just for mixing it up through different chains, I can see them successfully leading us by the nose through otherwise "unrewarding" quests. All in all, I like the sound of the ideas.

	stainer wrote on May 16^th, 2013 at 9:26am: Oh you are good. I will be watching you. QuantumFX wrote on Jun 5^th, 2013 at 11:11am: You are an evil human being.� m4lacka wrote on Mar 29^th, 2014 at 7:04am: wow that post hurt a lot more than any of the namecalling i expected. Now I see why ppl consider you evil.
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rest One Man Wolfpack Offline Posts: 7223 Joined: Aug 13^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #8 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:45am	Print Post
	I miss the underlevel bonus. Nothing like seeing if you were up to snuff on a level 4 in elite SC.


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Flav Vault Frog Offline One Frog to Rule them All! Posts: 9989 Location: Land of the Frogs Joined: Aug 29^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #9 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:46am	Print Post
	bob the builder wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:27am: If the Underlevel bonus is added back along with the "ransack xp" mechanic added, I would think everyone would just use the same quests to get levelled. Everyone at level 1-2 would just Run Kobold's New Ringleader 9 times.� �Then move to Tangleroot... then to Deleras... then to Pit/Tear... then to Von3... then Crucible. Which is what they stopped, for the most part, from happening when they added the elite streak and took away the under-level bonus. Yeah everybody was farming the same quests at that time, but if you look at it that's also what happens right now. so if you revert to the old system, and changes XPs from quests in such a way that all the quests give more or less the same amount of XP ( proportional to the time spent in the quest at level on normal ) , people will start running the quests they prefer instead of the high XP/Min quests ( as there won't be high XP/Min quests, just average XP/Min quests� ) The only drawback of the system : zergers will hate it... as you can't zerg through a quest 5 level over your level raising red alert and hope to survive the fight at the door.
	« Last Edit: Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:48am by Flav »
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rest One Man Wolfpack Offline Posts: 7223 Joined: Aug 13^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #10 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:51am	Print Post
	You can if you're good enough.


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bob the builder Abbot Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 772 Joined: Apr 19^th, 2011	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #11 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:06am	Print Post
	Flav wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 10:46am: Yeah everybody was farming the same quests at that time, but if you look at it that's also what happens right now. so if you revert to the old system, and changes XPs from quests in such a way that all the quests give more or less the same amount of XP ( proportional to the time spent in the quest at level on normal ) , people will start running the quests they prefer instead of the high XP/Min quests ( as there won't be high XP/Min quests, just average XP/Min quests� ) The only drawback of the system : zergers will hate it... as you can't zerg through a quest 5 level over your level raising red alert and hope to survive the fight at the door. There are a few quests where this is done, but I've been going the completionist route in the last 9 months, and we find that hitting all the quests once on elite at each level works out very well for leveling up. There are a few quests we will do E/H/N (Ringleader, Tear, Pit, Deleras Pt 2 and Part 4, the Three crypts, Von 3) while levelling... and we miss some as we are capped with the banked XP. Sure there is a faster way than the way we do it, but it keeps us from getting too bored... and with the monster manual, I just calculated that at Level 18, I got over 140K XP without trying to hunt anything down because we hit such a wide variety of quests. Essentially I got 140K XP without doing anything other than running quests we were going to run anyways.
	« Last Edit: Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:07am by bob the builder »

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Darkrok Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1066 Joined: Nov 10^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #12 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:10am	Print Post
	bob the builder wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:06am: There are a few quests where this is done, but I've been going the completionist route in the last 9 months, and we find that hitting all the quests once on elite at each level works out very well for leveling up. There are a few quests we will do E/H/N (Ringleader, Tear, Pit, Deleras Pt 2 and Part 4, the Three crypts, Von 3) while levelling... and we miss some as we are capped with the banked XP. Sure there is a faster way than the way we do it, but it keeps us from getting too bored... and with the monster manual, I just calculated that at Level 18, I got over 140K XP without trying to hunt anything down because we hit such a wide variety of quests. Essentially I got 140K XP without doing anything other than running quests we were going to run anyways. That's how I've been running lately, primarily to get extra favor. It's definitely effective as long as you pick quests you know well enough to fly through.

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NOTpopejubal Epic Poster Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 4096 Location: Let go or get dragged. Joined: Apr 17^th, 2013 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #13 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:20am	Print Post
	Tthe ransack XP timer won't matter at all for heroic leveling. Anyone who is zerging won't be anywhere near that level when the ransack timer expires and anyone who is going to be at the same level when the ransack timer expires isn't someone that will ransack a single quest for the XP/minute. It will mean that lots of people will be ablee to run quests in their heroic version and hen again in epic version. That's a good thing. Being able to make repeated runs on epic quests for xp from epic quests while leveling to 25/28 and then go back for ED XP a week later will also be nice. I look forward to not needing to avoid quests just because I want to run them later.


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NOTpopejubal Epic Poster Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 4096 Location: Let go or get dragged. Joined: Apr 17^th, 2013 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #14 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:24am	Print Post
	And 1x Elite and done or 1x Hard + 1x Normal (for people who can't hack 1x Elite) is pretty good XP/minute no matter what the quest is (possible exceptions include The Pit for people who suck at The Pit and a couple of Amrath quests for people who suck at DDO in general.)


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bob the builder Abbot Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 772 Joined: Apr 19^th, 2011	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #15 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:33am	Print Post
	Right now, I'm so upset that I get a 70% penalty in VON3 on my monk because I did it 4 times while levelling and then 3 times at epic before it was known that being capped at 25 stops the repeat penalty incrementer.


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Darth Anonymous Titan Demolisher Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 366 Joined: Nov 28^th, 2012	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #16 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:35am	Print Post
	Shifting XP to lower levels and sagas seems to me like just a new scheme by Turbine to sell packs that perhaps people skip now since there is so much F2P content at lower levels. If you seriously TR they already sold you all the high level packs a long time ago. Why not just do a little TP store juggling and put the emphasis onto those low level packs that perhaps are not selling now in order to increase revenue. While I think these changes will be good for my play style I also suspect that there is much more to why Turbine is looking for ways to encourage us to run this content. I am guessing that how awesome the saga bonus is will also be relative to how few of the packs Turbine has sold of that content and also to the TP cost of the packs. Although the cost/reward issue seems like it should be a natural consequence in my opinion so I would be cool with that. I already own all the packs though so it seems like the sagas will just be free gravy for me.
	« Last Edit: Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:37am by Darth Anonymous »

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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #17 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 1:49pm	Print Post
	Darth Anonymous wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 11:35am: Shifting XP to lower levels and sagas seems to me like just a new scheme by Turbine to sell packs that perhaps people skip now since there is so much F2P content at lower levels. If you seriously TR they already sold you all the high level packs a long time ago. Why not just do a little TP store juggling and put the emphasis onto those low level packs that perhaps are not selling now in order to increase revenue. While I think these changes will be good for my play style I also suspect that there is much more to why Turbine is looking for ways to encourage us to run this content. I am guessing that how awesome the saga bonus is will also be relative to how few of the packs Turbine has sold of that content and also to the TP cost of the packs. Although the cost/reward issue seems like it should be a natural consequence in my opinion so I would be cool with that. I already own all the packs though so it seems like the sagas will just be free gravy for me. Nah. I doubt it. Low level XP speed running has always used STK, Tangleroot, Necro 1 and 2, Deleras, and VoN. People are still going to avoid 3BC, Sentinels, Carnival, and any of the other crappy packs. There is so much XP from level 1-12 that you can't possibly need to buy another pack to deal with it. Von3 and Shadow Crypt alone are good for 500k XP between them. Add in Delera's 4, Tear, Gwylans, Pit, Stormcleave and Delera's 2 and you could double the XP needed and still not be in trouble. If you were, you still have Wiz King, OOB, Von4, Von5, and Relic to get you some extra so that you are entering GH with a banked level right on time. And if that XP had been pulled from the end, GH, Orchard, Vale and Monestary/Kobold would finish you off with no problem. The packs you would need: STK, Tangleroot, Deleras, Necro1, Necro2, VoN, Desert, GH, Necro 4, Vale, Reavers Reach. I'm pretty sure nothing in that list is on the bottom of the pack sales list.


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GooFY Abbot Raider Offline Just one of those days... Posts: 771 Location: Washington State Joined: Dec 12^th, 2011 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #18 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 1:55pm	Print Post
	Player idea of XP rebalance:� Boost XP of quests that are currently run on average less than one time per life per character. Turbine idea of XP rebalance: Lower XP of quests that are currently run on average more than three times (i.e. E/H/N) per life per character.


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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #19 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 2:00pm	Print Post
	GooFY wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 1:55pm: Player idea of XP rebalance:� Boost XP of quests that are currently run on average less than one time per life per character. Turbine idea of XP rebalance: Lower XP of quests that are currently run on average more than three times (i.e. E/H/N) per life per character. My player idea of XP rebalance: Fix the 2TR XP curve so that you don't need 2 million XP to get the last 4 levels. I couldn't care less about them altering XP for quests.


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Flav Vault Frog Offline One Frog to Rule them All! Posts: 9989 Location: Land of the Frogs Joined: Aug 29^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #20 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 2:16pm	Print Post
	Asheras wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 2:00pm: My player idea of XP rebalance:� Fix the 2TR XP curve so that you don't need 2 million XP to get the last 4 levels.� I couldn't care less about them altering XP for quests. yeah that can be another option, instead of hitting on the quest XP, making changes to the XP needed to level after first life. Now I honestly don't know which one is better in the long run.

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Darth Anonymous Titan Demolisher Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 366 Joined: Nov 28^th, 2012	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #21 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 2:24pm	Print Post
	It's not really a XP curve fix. It's more a redistribution.


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Darkrok Shroud Slacker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 1066 Joined: Nov 10^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #22 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 3:06pm	Print Post
	Darth Anonymous wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 2:24pm: It's not really a XP curve fix. It's more a redistribution. Even a redistribution could be very helpful to the players. The simple fact is that there's not enough xp in those levels to warrant the amount of xp required. Even if you redistribute earlier in the curve there's generally enough quests to absorb that. I often find myself running less than half the quests at any given level in the early game. It's only in the 17-20 range that I find myself having to repeat, hit slayers, etc.

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Dhalgren Big Sexy Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 282 Joined: Aug 2^nd, 2011	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #23 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 3:25pm	Print Post
	Darth Anonymous wrote on Jun 20^th, 2013 at 2:24pm: It's not really a XP curve fix. It's more a redistribution. You have a source for that?. Purplefooz specifically said the curves would be flattened to change the amount of XP needed for leveling across various level ranges, but everybody is ignoring that and talking like he said they would be redistributing XP between quests. The only thing I can find that indicates that they might be doing this is the first paragraph of his post where he says ". . . several new features and changes coming to quest XP in the expansion.". That could indicate a redistribution, but given that nothing else in the post mentions anything other than quest XP systems changes, it could also just be referring to the XP system updates he spends the rest of the post talking about.


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Asheras Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline This is why we can't have nice things. Posts: 10230 Location: Ohio Joined: Jun 9^th, 2010 Gender:	Re: Upcoming Quest XP Changes Reply #24 - Jun 20^th, 2013 at 3:36pm	Print Post
	Yep. 7-12 is overloaded and 17-20 is too sparse. The XP is just about double from a base TR (1.9 to 4.4 million, so it's actually a 230% increase). If you just took the XP at each level and multiplied it by 2.3, wouldn't that make for a better curve? Level Base XP New TR2 Current TR2 Difference 1 0 0 0 0 2 5,000 11,500 5,500 -6,000 3 15,000 34,500 18,000 -17500 4 30,000 69,000 39,000 -30000 5 40,000 92,000 56,000 -36000 6 50,000 115,000 75,000 -40000 7 60,000 138,000 96,000 -42000 8 70,000 161,000 119,000 -42000 9 80,000 184,000 144,000 -40000 10 90,000 207,000 171,000 -36000 11 110,000 253,000 220,000 -33000 12 110,000 253,000 231,000 -21000 13 120,000 276,000 264,000 -12000 14 130,000 299,000 299,000 0 15 140,000 322,000 336,000 14000 16 150,000 345,000 375,000 30000 17 160,000 368,000 416,000 48,000 18 170,000 391,000 459,000 68,000 19 180,000 414,000 504,000 90,000 20 190,000 437,000 551,000 114,000 1,900,000 4,370,000 4,378,500 8,500 What's wrong with the above? (Besides the formatting might suck) Basically move 360-370k of xp from level 15+ to (mostly) levels 5-11. Where the best XP quests in the game are. The 8500 xp difference in the two charts is a rounding error, by the way. I wasn't being 100% exact with my numbers in calculating the 2.3 multiple.


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