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Very Hot Topic (More than 75 Replies) Update 31 Loot Preview (Read 28998 times)
QuantumFX
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #25 - Apr 19th, 2016 at 7:48pm
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I could deal with less Turbine “creativity” with the stat bonuses.  We now have Enhancement, Insight, Exceptional, Profane, Quality, and Festival.  Exceptional and Festival are slotable, so I can ignore them for a second.  That still leaves 4 different effing effects to try to slot.  Which gets more ridiculous on MAD characters.  I would have preferred to see Quality and Profane condensed into “Divine”, given some alignment options, and only stuck on raid/epic items.
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #26 - Apr 19th, 2016 at 9:43pm
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I don't want this. I want more Murlynd's Spoons. A whole list.

Items like:
Ring of Air Breathing - Allows the wearer to breathe air. Flavor Text:  What? You can already breathe air? You lucky bastard.

Make my vendor trash amusing, or let them drop as rarely as Murlynd's Spoon does. Add them to the store (especially old PnP items that are useless in a quest, like a Flagon of Endless Water), and Turbine will turn on the money faucet.

DDO benefits immensely from RPG immersive elements like this.

There are other directions to go other than power creep.
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #27 - Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:04pm
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Revaulting wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 9:43pm:
Items like:
Ring of Air Breathing - Allows the wearer to breathe air. Flavor Text:  What? You can already breathe air? You lucky bastard.

Yeah, put them in for a limited time, and then remove them and add Aboleths as a monster. Now *that* would be creative. And funny.
  

Turdbin, keep changing the DDO rules, because McDonalds sold over 200 billion hamburgers by changing the recipe for their Special Sauce every couple of months to keep interest up.
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #28 - Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:05pm
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QuantumFX wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 7:48pm:
I could deal with less Turbine “creativity” with the stat bonuses.  We now have Enhancement, Insight, Exceptional, Profane, Quality, and Festival.  Exceptional and Festival are slotable, so I can ignore them for a second.  That still leaves 4 different effing effects to try to slot.  Which gets more ridiculous on MAD characters.  I would have preferred to see Quality and Profane condensed into “Divine”, given some alignment options, and only stuck on raid/epic items.


Totally agree with this.  It seems casters who don't ultra specialize (e.g. force wizards) are left being subpar because it's near impossible to get max DPS and max crit for more than one element at a time.
  
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #29 - Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:29pm
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QuantumFX wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 7:48pm:
I could deal with less Turbine “creativity” with the stat bonuses.  We now have Enhancement, Insight, Exceptional, Profane, Quality, and Festival.  Exceptional and Festival are slotable, so I can ignore them for a second.  That still leaves 4 different effing effects to try to slot.  Which gets more ridiculous on MAD characters.  I would have preferred to see Quality and Profane condensed into “Divine”, given some alignment options, and only stuck on raid/epic items.



What I'm seeing is a lot of low plus "Quality" bonuses that would be all well and good but exactly where are we supposed to slot the actual high plus standard bonus item?

Example: Quality Str 1 but where do we slot Str 12?

Don't say Augment Slots because Augments only go up to like +7 max and are way behind random gen/named loot at every level!
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #30 - Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:35pm
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Ring and belt a must for mellees, but damn fitting in double-strike gear is gonna suck now
  
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #31 - Apr 19th, 2016 at 11:08pm
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noamineo wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 6:11pm:
Honestly, how much creativity do you really demand from a list of stat bonuses? We haven't seen the names or the quest they drop from yet. Every item can't have it's own unique special effect, there are too many of those already.


I went half way and acknowledged improvement.  More than most here.
But as some good posts above outline, there is still room to do something different.  Creativity requires something more than "same as before, but bigger numbers"
  
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #32 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 1:35am
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FranOhmsford wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:29pm:
What I'm seeing is a lot of low plus "Quality" bonuses that would be all well and good but exactly where are we supposed to slot the actual high plus standard bonus item?

Example: Quality Str 1 but where do we slot Str 12?

Don't say Augment Slots because Augments only go up to like +7 max and are way behind random gen/named loot at every level!


Ability augment slots go up to +8 you noobtard.
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #33 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 2:42am
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Old DDO was a web of stat bonuses of more or less the same power with an oddball unique or set bonus here or there. Getting ahead was finding a way to make the epic gem of many facets work, or ensuring the libram got slotted in right, or making room for your dual unarmed ToD rings.

We remember, and it was interesting.
  
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #34 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 2:54am
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FranOhmsford wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:29pm:
What I'm seeing is a lot of low plus "Quality" bonuses that would be all well and good but exactly where are we supposed to slot the actual high plus standard bonus item?

Example: Quality Str 1 but where do we slot Str 12?

Don't say Augment Slots because Augments only go up to like +7 max and are way behind random gen/named loot at every level!

You slot stat +15 on a LGS weapon.
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #35 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 2:54am
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AtomicMew wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:05pm:
near impossible to get max DPS and max crit for more than one element at a time.

the only thing going for that, atm, is Dissolution combined with sticks and rings. 1 named item.... woot
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #36 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 6:04am
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QuantumFX wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 7:48pm:
I could deal with less Turbine “creativity” with the stat bonuses.  We now have Enhancement, Insight, Exceptional, Profane, Quality, and Festival.  Exceptional and Festival are slotable, so I can ignore them for a second.  That still leaves 4 different effing effects to try to slot.  Which gets more ridiculous on MAD characters.  I would have preferred to see Quality and Profane condensed into “Divine”, given some alignment options, and only stuck on raid/epic items.


Yup, and too many different types of bonuses overall.  Fucking pain in the ass, just make the bonus bigger then putting 3 different types of potency on 1 item.
  
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #37 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 6:12am
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ddo loot sucks. they dropped the ball with the new (old now) augment system. Pretty much every augment sucks. theyre all way under performing compared anything else at the same level. For starters, the augments should have all mimiced loot enhancements at the same level. Diamonds of +8 stat at lvl 28 wen u can find +12 gear at lvl 28 makes no sense to me. Diamonds of +3 stat at lvl 14 when u can find or even cannith craft +6 stat items by lvl 9.

Augments were added as a way of adding underwhelming bonuses that dont really matter, aside from the UNIQUE ones that are mandatory on every toon. When you develop a system that is 80% useless and 20% mandatory, youve fucked up.

Augments and gear itself should be reconsidered. augments should have been the generic effect slots on every item. No item should come preset with generic effects. We should be allowed to build our gear.

consider encrusted ring. 2 generic effects, 2 specific effects. currently this ring is either useful for 1 level, or by now possibly completely invalidated by current RNG loot. If the generic slots were instead open rather than pigeonholed into +6/+1strength, perhaps this once sought raid item would still have use on certain builds, at any level, as long as the specific effects catered to the build.

If all the good, semi unique loot was customizable in this fashion, a lot more loot wouldnt be invalidated, the value of older quests and raids would increase, and even additional potential builds would become more viable.

Any time you look at a new piece of loot, i want you to consider just for a moment, how much better it would be if the preset generic stat bonuses on it were customizable to the specific stats you wanted to elevate, and only the loot/lore specific effects were fixed and unchangable.
« Last Edit: Apr 20th, 2016 at 6:19am by eighnuss »  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #38 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 6:34am
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eighnuss wrote on Apr 20th, 2016 at 6:12am:
ddo loot sucks. they dropped the ball with the new (old now) augment system. Pretty much every augment sucks. theyre all way under performing compared anything else at the same level. For starters, the augments should have all mimiced loot enhancements at the same level. Diamonds of +8 stat at lvl 28 wen u can find +12 gear at lvl 28 makes no sense to me. Diamonds of +3 stat at lvl 14 when u can find or even cannith craft +6 stat items by lvl 9.

Augments were added as a way of adding underwhelming bonuses that dont really matter, aside from the UNIQUE ones that are mandatory on every toon. When you develop a system that is 80% useless and 20% mandatory, youve fucked up.

Augments and gear itself should be reconsidered. augments should have been the generic effect slots on every item. No item should come preset with generic effects. We should be allowed to build our gear.

consider encrusted ring. 2 generic effects, 2 specific effects. currently this ring is either useful for 1 level, or by now possibly completely invalidated by current RNG loot. If the generic slots were instead open rather than pigeonholed into +6/+1strength, perhaps this once sought raid item would still have use on certain builds, at any level, as long as the specific effects catered to the build.

If all the good, semi unique loot was customizable in this fashion, a lot more loot wouldnt be invalidated, the value of older quests and raids would increase, and even additional potential builds would become more viable.

Any time you look at a new piece of loot, i want you to consider just for a moment, how much better it would be if the preset generic stat bonuses on it were customizable to the specific stats you wanted to elevate, and only the loot/lore specific effects were fixed and unchangable.


I understand your point, but consider this.

Augments are intentionally less powerful, because you can customise them.  I agree they're too under-powered - they should be one step back.  So +11 stat at ML28 for example.

If loot were completely customisable, it would create some problems.
Firstly, D&D is premised on always having some vulnerability.  Toons shouldn't be able to do everything and be invulnerable to everything.
Otherwise the threat/challenge is diminished and the enjoyment goes with it.  Every player desires their toon to be as powerful as possible.  Once they reach that objective they don't have as much motivation to keep playing.

Secondly, random loot would be a lot less useful.  With an AH, you can just buy the equipment with the slots colours you need and your done.

Thirdly, ongoing engagement (game sub longevity).  Once you had your ideal combination of items with slots (similiar to Path Of Exile system), what would be your motivation to continue seeking equipment?

The game engine could handle it as the LOTRO legendary weapons from years ago used to be like what you propose.
I also like the PoE system - but it was designed from the ground up though and would be very hard to retrospectively implement.
  
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #39 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 7:23am
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Boring but somewhat useful loot? Could have been worse.

NoWorries should move on to a game where no one complains, like educational aps for preschool Smiley
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #40 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 7:23am
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DropBear wrote on Apr 20th, 2016 at 6:34am:
I understand your point, but consider this.

Augments are intentionally less powerful, because you can customise them.  I agree they're too under-powered - they should be one step back.  So +11 stat at ML28 for example.

If loot were completely customisable, it would create some problems.
Firstly, D&D is premised on always having some vulnerability.  Toons shouldn't be able to do everything and be invulnerable to everything.
Otherwise the threat/challenge is diminished and the enjoyment goes with it.  Every player desires their toon to be as powerful as possible.  Once they reach that objective they don't have as much motivation to keep playing.

Secondly, random loot would be a lot less useful.  With an AH, you can just buy the equipment with the slots colours you need and your done.

Thirdly, ongoing engagement (game sub longevity).  Once you had your ideal combination of items with slots (similiar to Path Of Exile system), what would be your motivation to continue seeking equipment?

The game engine could handle it as the LOTRO legendary weapons from years ago used to be like what you propose.
I also like the PoE system - but it was designed from the ground up though and would be very hard to retrospectively implement.


all valid points, none of which deserve to be dismissed. If a system like the one in my fan fiction above were to actually be implemented, these would all be top priorities regarding the balancing of this system against existing loot, the RNG, and replayability. regarding encouraging a continued grind, they could either add some kind of endless upgrade path to gear, or continue along the path of loot specific enchantments. Random loot itself could pretty much remain as is, generic effects but no specific effects, slottable. get a belt with generic 2 slots, pop in con 6 and gfl 30. run tod shit and eventually get your knosts belt- sell your old rng belt, place your con 6 and gfl into knosts, and the upgrade is the specific effects. if those specific effects are so valuable that you would choose to run that belt at 30, with only 2 slots, vs a belt like epic thoughful which could have 3 or 4 slots but perhaps a less useful specific effect to your specific build, that choice is yours. the gear that exists is too limited to level ranges, with no comparable counter parts beyond or below those ranges.

Theres tons of loot in this game that would be worth using IF it made sense. loot shouldnt be about min max, it should be about unique effects that cater to unique builds, paired with level appropriate bonuses in expected areas. in the current game, gear is slotted primarily to maximize the stats each player feels they need, followed by drizzling in some flavor in any open spots. Wouldnt it be nice to instead gear out by prioritizing unique gear specific effects, knowing you will be able to fit in the shit youd maximize anyway at the end?
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #41 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 7:55am
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Bobbicus wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 3:29pm:
The guardspam bracers are actually kinda cool. Haven't seen focused guard gear since greensteel.

I thought there was a problem with guards right now where if you have more than one of the same type (elemental damage, alignment damage, etc), then only one procs and the others do not.
  

OldCoaly wrote on May 27th, 2016 at 11:27am:
If one of those types of weapons isn't "wraps", then it's a non-starter for Fran.
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #42 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 8:00am
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Alex DeLarge wrote on Apr 20th, 2016 at 1:35am:
Ability augment slots go up to +8 you noobtard.

Yea, because the difference between +7 and +8 when you can get +12 or +14 on a random generated item is soooooooo significant.
  

OldCoaly wrote on May 27th, 2016 at 11:27am:
If one of those types of weapons isn't "wraps", then it's a non-starter for Fran.
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #43 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 8:08am
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nowAvaultie wrote on Apr 20th, 2016 at 8:00am:
Yea, because the difference between +7 and +8 when you can get +12 or +14 on a random generated item is soooooooo significant.


It isn't. But not knowing shit still is not nowing shit.
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #44 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 9:46am
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Dispel wrote on Apr 20th, 2016 at 8:08am:
It isn't. But not knowing shit still is not nowing shit.

That's the point: the difference is so insignificant that the fact he got it wrong is also insignificant.
  

OldCoaly wrote on May 27th, 2016 at 11:27am:
If one of those types of weapons isn't "wraps", then it's a non-starter for Fran.
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #45 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 10:50am
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Alex DeLarge wrote on Apr 20th, 2016 at 1:35am:
Ability augment slots go up to +8 you noobtard.


and equally worthless-ish
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #46 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 11:55am
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The creation of Enhancement/Insightful/Quality/Exceptional/Profane/Festival stat bonuses is annoying in loot, however, I tend to not worry about profane or quality stat bonuses on any build except a DC caster.  +4 to quality strength on a stength based melee is not better than +10 deadly or +15% doublestrike or +22% armor piercing.  If it fits, fine, but chasing the "highest possible" base stat to the exclusion of other effects is a fool's errand. 

  
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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #47 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 12:51pm
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FranOhmsford wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 10:29pm:
What I'm seeing is a lot of low plus "Quality" bonuses that would be all well and good but exactly where are we supposed to slot the actual high plus standard bonus item?

Example: Quality Str 1 but where do we slot Str 12?

Don't say Augment Slots because Augments only go up to like +7 max and are way behind random gen/named loot at every level!


Fran are you OK? While your post is not 100% accurate I find it to actually make sense and not make me want to hit myself in the balls with a hammer.

Are you sick, or has the little fanboi in you finally been raped to death by turbine?
« Last Edit: Apr 20th, 2016 at 1:57pm by Who Cares »  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #48 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 12:55pm
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I just wish they'd finally come through on the crafting pass so I can craft at least SOME of this stuff. Wading through the AH in search of an item that fits stopped being fun 4 loot passes ago...
  

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Re: Update 31 Loot Preview
Reply #49 - Apr 20th, 2016 at 1:59pm
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slothinator wrote on Apr 19th, 2016 at 1:51pm:
Docent - Wooden - Insightful PRR +22, Insightful MRR +22, repair amp +72, Enhancement Sheltering +45, Green Augment Slot


docent looks decent
  
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