Revaulting wrote on Sep 19^th, 2016 at 10:51pm:


Don't get me wrong.  I agree with the issue of saturation and the feeling of too many old ingredients crowding up the bags or banks is a problem.  As a player, I would love for them to implement more turn-ins/swaps/barters like what they did for sands scrolls.  That should be expanded to all seals/shards/scrolls in the game.  And I think it would make all that content more valuable and replayable.  I think that Comms of Heroism should have more uses than just upgrading CiTW weapons and eGH armors.  It would make FoT and CiTW more worthwhile to run.

I would love for them to find uses for LoB mats beyond that individual system.  Something that makes those two raids worth running again.  Both are fun, and challenging on EE in low epics. 

I get that they can't go back and revamp CC loot and eveningstar challenge loot and LoB alchemicals, so it would be cool to just make the ingredients useful in some other way. 

But I also get why Turbine doesn't do that.  Because of the bulk of those mats sitting out there that would immediately be used to obtain things without having to run content.  (which would be counter to the goal of such turn-in creations.  To create incentives to run the older content).

But I still think doing so would be a net positive for the game overall. 

I also think that Turbine should focus on more novel and creative quest design and challenges vs. just pure grinds.  Unique puzzles, traps, and combat mechanics.  Things that require the party to coordinate or be focused and organized or skilled vs. just being able to brute smash stuff with DPS.  But I'm looking for challenges beyond Sacks of HP or incoming damage that is in the one-shot range for players with 200+ PRR.  Unless those HP can be mitigated through in quest tactics or mechanics or that damage can be mitigated via in quest tactics, positioning, timing, or skill.  The end fight of DoJ is an example of this poorly done.  That tactical detonation effect that goes off would be a unique and challenging mechanic that I would have no problem with having be a virtual insta-kill.  If there was a tell/way to predict the location and players had a methodology for avoiding it.   And the boss had enough HP to make it even be a factor in most runs.  Stuff like that (when done correctly, not when done like that was) can create challenging fights that are fun to repeat and build characters and solutions for.  The end fight of Slavers 3 is another with a unique mechanic that is a good try, but with a little more thought and effort could have been really fun and challenging.  As it is, it just isn't a challenge though.  Because the party is never really at risk.   

I also think the game needs a new, exclusive grind for level cap.  The 8 Legendary 6 man quests and 3 Legendary Raids should all get a Legendary difficulty added.  This difficulty should be much tougher than LE.  Very tough to beat (if you can) with completionists and epic completionist toons geared out in correct destinies with optimized builds and twists by competent players using tactics.  They should be virtually impossible to solo.

The 6 man quests should have a legendary timer - 1 completion per day.  The raids a 3 day legendary timer per completion.  No bypasses for legendary difficulty.  Each completion earns a Legendary Token.  These tokens get you shit you can't get any other way.  A way to improve your character while staying at cap.  But only by running the hardest content.  You use the TR/ETR process and the non-legendary quests and lower difficulty versions of the legendary quests to get a character to a point where they can play in this pool. 

(If the above concept sounds vaguely familiar, that's because they got pretty close to it once upon a time.  They just made the grind too infinite and they messed it up with a massive level cap raise)

There are a lot of differences of opinion I have with how Turbine is proceeding vs. how I would like them to proceed.  I get that frustration by players.  I have it too in a lot of areas.

Meursault wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 8:58am:


Wait... what did they do to ghost-touch? I use the ML1 augment most times.. what did they do?

An example of a unique puzzle mechanic that was created and used once and never re-used:

Monastery's end puzzle.  You have to solve a puzzle while a very hard to kill dude who can two shot most at level mobs is attacking you.  And random spawns are attacking and running all over the puzzle fucking it up.  Oh and the hard to kill dude disco balls the puzzle like mad with a very high DC disco ball. 

Ever tried to solo that puzzle?  It's a bitch.  No matter how powerful your character is.  And hirelings are no help.  But at least 1 (preferrably 2) competent players with you and it becomes much easier.  Because teamwork.

Sure, at this point you can just kick Sanyasi's ass at this point if you want and skip a chest and not do the puzzle, but back in the day and at level, that was a tall order.   

Why don't we  have more of this?  A puzzle with people fucking with you non-stop while you are trying to solve it.  They did it a little in Delerium, to fun affect there as well.  They did it a little in deathwyrm with the mirrors, but the mobs spawn rarely and they don't fuck with the mirrors or impact your ability to turn them.  You can ignore them if you have strong enough defenses. 

I enjoy monastery every TR life because that end fight is not a total yawner.

ZooperDooper wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 9:28am:

It's now crafter level 250 with a materials list you need an epic character to farm. Ghost touch, that lowbie staple you want to use through the Depths of whatever and Chamber of Insanity, and throw out when you can wear Ethereal Bracers or Dream Visor, now takes most of your first life to be able to craft.

Not that Sev would realize what poor planning that is, he doesn't run that low level stuff because there is nobody to cast raise dead on his soul stone 

Asheras wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 1:06pm:

The big point your missing is noobs don't have to be all alone in the world and discovering everything for themselves. Honestly, those noobs probably don't make it to level 5. I've brought many players into the game, and helped many new players from a low level to mid level. Helped players will absolutely know about crafting at low level first life. So will experienced players starting on a new server. Or kids joining to play with their parents.

You gripe all the time about how there is no challenge for you and that kills the fun, well, how about a new player who learns about crafting and wants knowledge but not a handout because that kills the fun? I get that your a grizzled vet and think primarily in terms of how things affect grizzled vets, but it's mportant to consider other playstyles too, even if you personally don't see many of them.

Your justification for ignoring the needs of new players because we have none is a self fufilling prophecy.

Meursault wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 1:29pm:


I've brought new players in.  My kids and some RL friends (old PnP buddies).  I never recommended crafting until they were at cap (back when cap was 20).  Those that have come in more recently, I don't even mention crafting at all, because it has been so outdated.  I just told them to hit all the dispensaries/purple bags and keep all the collectibles and essences for future use. 

The AH and chain end rewards are the best place to get those special use items.  The game actually does a good job of giving you stuff you can use later in the Waterworks, STK, Catacombs, Tangleroot, Deleras, CO6, and Threnal chain end rewards.  Catacombs will give you everything you need to hit ghostly and sliver DR or good DR mobs.  (Blade of Inquisition, Dagger of Inquisition, Eternal Rest, or Pillar of Light).  If you play the game through in order, you will have what you need, especially if you have a vet guide suggesting a good progression of quests and good end reward selections.

I don't gripe about no challenge, btw.  i think you have me confused with other posters.  I enjoy the game at the current challenge level presented.  I would not mind a Reaper mode or a higher challenge level presented, as long as it was confined to level cap/end game.  I also play some permadeath on another server and see how much more challenging the game is when you aren't loaded with gear, PL's, materials, and plat. 

I get that we need to focus on new players, but I don't think crafting is a part of that focus.  I think crafting is a more advanced concept. 

   

Cloak of Invisibility is ml9, has Ghostly and drops from a frequently ran ftp raid.  No packs required.

It's not a bad thing if new characters have somewhat of challenge with incorporeal enemies from levels 5-8.

It teaches them an aspect of the game.

Meursault wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 12:40pm:


Like I said... Ghost Bane is a ML1 augment that is REALLY easy to get.... ghost touch weapons are also really easy to attain... not seeing the reason for outrage here 

Meursault wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 4:01pm:


Night Revels has it for like a single turn in, not sure if Remnant guy has em too. Most folks I know give em out for the asking.

Asheras wrote on Sep 19^th, 2016 at 12:05am:

Killed it with fire.  I used to make crap for new players all the time.  With the prices of doing that in NewCC being so high, I can't do that any more.  It doesn't hurt me in the slightest, it only hurts those I would like to help.

Asheras wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 9:23am:

I don't get this argument.

There is a bulk of old ingredients lying around. It is a symptom of the problem we both identify as no crafting system integration. What this argument says is that the symptom is a valid reason for not solving the problem.

It still doesn't even seem to be Turbine's position, because if it were, they would at least be integrating systems going forward. We can see with Remnants, ToEE, LGS, New CC, & Slaver's that they are not.

Revaulting wrote on Sep 20^th, 2016 at 10:15pm:



That's a fair point.  Even if they didn't want to bring the old stuff foward, they could build a new, more integrated ingredients system going forward.