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Very Hot Topic (More than 75 Replies) Some shit some guy sent me (Read 7738 times)
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Some shit some guy sent me
Mar 11th, 2020 at 10:03am
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I guess this qualifies as drama or something. /yawn

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Ok so I'm not exactly trying to get Lynnabel in trouble here, but if it happens whatever.

The TL:DR part is Daybreak Games runs almost everything except the development and monetization methods Sevs crack addled brain comes up with.

So around about the time that they promoted those nifty $300 supporters packs? That was Daybreak telling them to shit or get off the pot basically or they'd fire a shit ton of their DDO staff and DDO would go into maintenance mode. Lucky for SSG only like, 3 folk got shitcanned out of the deal because they successfully milked the whales.

Now they have to keep meeting sales figures to keep alive, and so Sev is basically under pressure of Daybreak to perform or DDO is dead, they don't get to shuffle LOTRO money to cover DDO's losses anymore because all their money goes directly to Daybreak and Daybreak cuts everybody their checks as well as doing any of their promotional work (which ofc Daybreak being a shitty ass company isn't going to do) and support (which is why support has gotten dramatically shittier because a bunch of people unfamiliar with the game are trying to understand what in the absolute fuck the retards whining at them to fix things are trying to say). So you've got Daybreak pushing their thumb up Sevs ass, and because he's not bright at marketing and they don't have anyone worth a damn to give good ideas, they keep pushing stupid as fuck monetization methods out the door hoping like fuck they can milk the whales as hard as possible.

The whales are stuck in their cycle of having more disposable income than sense to realize they are pushing broken shit out the door faster than they can fix it to keep Daybreak happy because of good ol sunk cost fallacy.

You can tell the stupidity behind Sevs decisions when it comes to things like Hard Core League where they incentivize spending money like a retarded Chris-chan at any opportunity, be it airship amenities or xp pots.

Everyone on the staff knows about this shit, so when they try to deflect they are defending their paychecks because most of these fucks (especially Cordovan) haven't got much of a resume to put together because the hiring policy is almost exclusively pulling people fresh from college if they haven't been around on the team since launch.

I wouldn't have bothered saying anything but it looks like the quality of the game and the direction it's taking is absolute fuckery and Daybreak and Sev are primarily to blame because Daybreak is pushing Sev to monetize and Sev is too stupid to understand how to monetize outside of microtransactions and the outlook for DDO is bleak because nobody can make a smart decision about the shit to save their lives. Also because it'd be kinda funny to watch everybody freak out that the game's balls are on the bandsaw every quarter but I didn't feel like posting it myself so I give it to you to decide what you want to do with the info. Or if it's even really that dramatic a reveal that Daybreak is running Sev to run the game into the ground, most people seem to be pretty pissed as is.


And in a follow-up:

Quote:
I forgot to mention something that is hilarious about where DDO/LOTRO was at the time they switched to Daybreak. Warner Brothers let Sev take both IPs with him for free, because they were worth so little to Warner Brothers that it didn't matter to them one bit. So any idea anyone had about DDO/LOTRO being worth anything is marginal, and Daybreak was the only company willing to risk taking SSG in at all because they don't have an attractive product.
  
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Technomage
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #1 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 10:25am
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These claims seem quite odd considering SSG claims Daybreak is just their Publisher and not their owner.

Something doesn't smell right here - either on SSG's part or Daybreak's part.

Also, not sure why Lynnabel would be in any sort of trouble, unless...
« Last Edit: Mar 11th, 2020 at 10:25am by Technomage »  

Do not try the patience of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger.

We are dreamers, shapers, singers, and makers. We study the mysteries of laser and circuit, crystal and scanner, holographic demons and invocation of equations. These are the tools we employ, and we know many things.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
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Strake
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #2 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 12:32pm
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Something about lynnabel going on about it like it was a secret.
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #3 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 12:35pm
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What i dont get is why dont they pick the low hanging fruit for money. There is a shit ton of it waiting on things that wouldnt affect the balance: cosmetics for example, plenty of room to mess wround with it and the crowd that likes it would pay good money for them. 

And now that we got mounts why dont sell some reskined horses at a ridiculous price on store? And while they are up to that, go the wow route and add some ultra rare shit to raids. People here love bragging right and that would be a great way to cather them.

  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #4 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 2:32pm
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As a side note, how do y'all Season Pass holders like that you have 9 months left on your sub and the only content packs that you get to keep is Keep on the Borderlands and the Soul Splitter pack?  Cheesy
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #5 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 2:35pm
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money : the Named Item Collection Vault ( in whatever form you make it )...
Everybody, and the dog would Spend TP on it if done right.

And there's many more ideas hidden in the official forum that could bring lots of money.
  

Yes my avatar is an Hermine eating a Greenland Lemming for brunch.
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raybob
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #6 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 3:46pm
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Technomage wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 10:25am:
These claims seem quite odd considering SSG claims Daybreak is just their Publisher and not their owner.

Something doesn't smell right here - either on SSG's part or Daybreak's part.


Also, not sure why Lynnabel would be in any sort of trouble, unless...



Even if Daybreak is "just" their publisher, they could have a lot of pull with SSG in other ways.  I think we've all seen one-sided business deals in other places to recognize that when one party is weaker/lesser they get a worse deal than if they were equals.

  
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Cripey
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #7 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:22pm
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Tough to decipher if any of it is real or just some whiny vaulter complaining about "whales" and disliking the way the game is.
  

Grands Superhero IRL

Or as they say in Ireland -
Derp derp derp derp. Yellow moons. Lassie.

Hordo wrote on Nov 21st, 2012 at 8:07am:
EDIT: BTW I love your post.  It reads as if English is your 3rd language behind gibberish and dipshit.


majmalphunktion wrote on Mar 20th, 2014 at 6:11pm:
what the fuck guys...

Jeesus fucking shit. This shit gets me called to the principals office.

Assholes.
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Technomage
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #8 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:26pm
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Cripey wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:22pm:
Tough to decipher if any of it is real or just some whiny vaulter complaining about "whales" and disliking the way the game is.

Pretty plausible, imo.
  

Do not try the patience of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger.

We are dreamers, shapers, singers, and makers. We study the mysteries of laser and circuit, crystal and scanner, holographic demons and invocation of equations. These are the tools we employ, and we know many things.

The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
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Cripey
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #9 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:35pm
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Technomage wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:26pm:
Pretty plausible, imo.


The source is questionable, anyone that doesn't understand the $300 vip deal was a money saving discount for players over normal vip monthly usually cannot do math or have an intellect to "report" anything reliable. That was the give away to me in the quoted info.

The rest of the story is just saying sev has to keep making money, big secret surprise really?
  

Grands Superhero IRL

Or as they say in Ireland -
Derp derp derp derp. Yellow moons. Lassie.

Hordo wrote on Nov 21st, 2012 at 8:07am:
EDIT: BTW I love your post.  It reads as if English is your 3rd language behind gibberish and dipshit.


majmalphunktion wrote on Mar 20th, 2014 at 6:11pm:
what the fuck guys...

Jeesus fucking shit. This shit gets me called to the principals office.

Assholes.
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goldgolem
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #10 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:38pm
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Technomage wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 10:25am:
These claims seem quite odd considering SSG claims Daybreak is just their Publisher and not their owner.



Basically in this case the publisher is the effective owner, as in being the effective ultimate decision maker - see EA and also Activision Blizzard as examples of how this relationship develops in practise over time. Publisher is basically the games industry version of Investor


If you look sat Daybreaks games, its clear they keep zombie games limping along to extract money out of them. Nothing here is setting the world on fire

EverQuest,
EverQuest II,
The Matrix Online,
PlanetSide,
Star Wars Galaxies,
Clone Wars Adventures,
Free Realms,
Vanguard: Saga of Heroes,
DC Universe Online,
PlanetSide 2,
H1Z1: Just Survive,
H1Z1: King of the Kill

« Last Edit: Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:55pm by goldgolem »  
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goldgolem
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #11 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 5:08pm
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These quotes from the massively article should tell you all you need to know about who pulls the puppet's strings...

Who is Standing Stone Games' CEO right now?
Jerry Snook: We don't have a CEO, but Rob, the Executive Producer, is our studio head.

You can’t provide an answer as to whether or not you have the ability to change publishers if your studio wanted or needed to?
Jerry Snook: We’re talking high-level legal stuff, so it’s probably better to leave these kind of questions to them.


If you dont have a CEO and arent free to do what you want, you are not in control. And the only reason that situation would exist in a business context is if DB called the shots

  
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Asheras
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #12 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 5:23pm
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goldgolem wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 5:08pm:
These quotes from the massively article should tell you all you need to know about who pulls the puppet's strings...

Who is Standing Stone Games' CEO right now?
Jerry Snook: We don't have a CEO, but Rob, the Executive Producer, is our studio head.

You can’t provide an answer as to whether or not you have the ability to change publishers if your studio wanted or needed to?
Jerry Snook: We’re talking high-level legal stuff, so it’s probably better to leave these kind of questions to them.


If you dont have a CEO and arent free to do what you want, you are not in control. And the only reason that situation would exist in a business context is if DB called the shots



A CEO is just a title.   It is more in vogue than President.   But for a long time companies had a President and Vice Presidents.   Now they have CEO's and CFO/CTO/CMO/COO, etc.   (Who are also Vice Presidents.  Typically Executive VIP's technically, but whatever).   Some companies go with a General Manager or Managing Partner as the head of the company.   IN a n newspaper, it would be the Editor in Chief.  In a game studio an Executive Producer title might make sense.  Someone is running day-to-day operations and has P&L responsibility.   That person does not need to have the CEO title.   I'd not get hung up on labels.

As for the publisher/studio relationship: I'm in software development.  My company makes programs we license/sell directly to customers.  We also have products that we sell to two different partners.  They then resell/distribute the product to their customers.   This could be white label, it could be grey label, VAR, etc.   Regardless, we have a contract with those two partners.  Each one is a 5 year term with a lot of requirements on both sides for performance and strict rules around notices, IP ownership, confidentiality, competition, solicitation, etc. related to termination or non-renewal.   I'm sure the relationship between DB and SSG has some language addressing these issues.   Maybe Cordovan is familiar with it.  Maybe he isn't.  Either way, there is no way he is discussing it on a podcast.   I know I wouldn't for any of my partners.   His dismissal of that question is to be expected and implies nothing as to the relationship between DB and SSG.

« Last Edit: Mar 11th, 2020 at 5:25pm by Asheras »  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #13 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 5:53pm
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Id agree in general but in other Massively interviews they make it pretty explicit that DB pulls the strings.

Publishers in the games industry have far more sway than general software partners in tech - see the EA and Activision for famous examples. its not an equal partnership

Im not bashing them for doing what they need to survive. I think its amazing they managed to get both games out of WB, get financing via DB and keep the games going.

On the personal side they have jobs they enjoy and get to make games they love - lots of people wish they had that setup!
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #14 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 6:08pm
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goldgolem wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 5:53pm:
On the personal side they have jobs they enjoy and get to make games they love - lots of people wish they had that setup!


I think the point is they don't get to make games they love, they panic from one dumpster fire decision to the next hoping to keep their paycheck. Meanwhile Sev is sitting back in his gaming chair playing findom in his finest leathers and keeps demanding his pay pigs cough up their financials, sweating bullets that his Daybreak pimp doesn't beat him again.
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #15 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 6:24pm
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Cripey wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:35pm:
The source is questionable, anyone that doesn't understand the $300 vip deal was a money saving discount for players over normal vip monthly

I am confused. Why would a person pay monthly, if they are considering buying the 2 year pass at 300, especially when a year long sub is 99 dollars? What else did the pass end up with? Borderlands, Soul Splitter, tiefling and alchemist?
  

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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #16 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 6:29pm
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Cripey wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 4:35pm:
The source is questionable, anyone that doesn't understand the $300 vip deal was a money saving discount for players over normal vip monthly usually cannot do math or have an intellect to "report" anything reliable. That was the give away to me in the quoted info.

The rest of the story is just saying sev has to keep making money, big secret surprise really?

$300 for 2 years is more than VIP pay for 3 years of subscription. They paid extra to keep the content that came out during that time and to get the daily gold rolls. Plus the cosmetic that I’ve never seen someone wear in game ever. That was not anything close to a “money saving discount.”
« Last Edit: Mar 11th, 2020 at 6:29pm by NOTpopejubal »  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #17 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 6:45pm
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NOTpopejubal wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 6:29pm:
Plus the cosmetic that I’ve never seen someone wear in game ever.


A good number of players in my guild wear it.  Small sample size, admittedly.   And now that you have close replicas you can glammer, it's less common.
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #18 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 7:06pm
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...
« Last Edit: Jun 26th, 2020 at 7:36am by Count Dante »  

Grand wrote on Mar 11th, 2017 at 12:08am:
I'm a big believer in the old adage saw that you should never make a bet you can't afford to lose!
                   


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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #19 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 8:11pm
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Fun fact about the Season Pass: It cost them maybe 20 minutes total to set up the daily gold dice roll and throw a new coat of silver paint on their shitty dragon armor. So with that in mind, they could have been a lot more generous with the package but were so inept that they could barely give it an even value over just subbing for 3 years. Even triple A games that throw out DLC at a faster rate for better games give more value with their 1 year season passes than SSG could squeak out without putting in any effort to their product for your dollars.
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #20 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:02pm
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NOTpopejubal wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 6:29pm:
$300 for 2 years is more than VIP pay for 3 years of subscription. They paid extra to keep the content that came out during that time and to get the daily gold rolls. Plus the cosmetic that I’ve never seen someone wear in game ever. That was not anything close to a “money saving discount.”


14.95 monthly sub times 24 months is about $360. Enough incentive saving 60 bucks and getting daily gold roll.

Might be able to have used the 60 bucks to get gand laid, but I dont think his mom gives discounts anymore.
  

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Or as they say in Ireland -
Derp derp derp derp. Yellow moons. Lassie.

Hordo wrote on Nov 21st, 2012 at 8:07am:
EDIT: BTW I love your post.  It reads as if English is your 3rd language behind gibberish and dipshit.


majmalphunktion wrote on Mar 20th, 2014 at 6:11pm:
what the fuck guys...

Jeesus fucking shit. This shit gets me called to the principals office.

Assholes.
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #21 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:06pm
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Cripey wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:02pm:
14.95 monthly sub times 24 months is about $360. Enough incentive saving 60 bucks and getting daily gold roll.

Might be able to have used the 60 bucks to get gand laid, but I dont think his mom gives discounts anymore.


Lolz. Can't tell if cucked or stupid. Both?
  
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NOTpopejubal
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #22 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:24pm
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Cripey wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:02pm:
14.95 monthly sub times 24 months is about $360. Enough incentive saving 60 bucks and getting daily gold roll.

Might be able to have used the 60 bucks to get gand laid, but I dont think his mom gives discounts anymore.

You can also get 1 year for $99
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #23 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:26pm
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And I don’t think anyone should go cheap with their sex workers during a global pandemic.
  
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Re: Some shit some guy sent me
Reply #24 - Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:30pm
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NOTpopejubal wrote on Mar 11th, 2020 at 9:24pm:
You can also get 1 year for $99


You can, but to many bannings for that. The VIP deal was attractive enough to pre pay where as the normal year stretch isnt.
  

Grands Superhero IRL

Or as they say in Ireland -
Derp derp derp derp. Yellow moons. Lassie.

Hordo wrote on Nov 21st, 2012 at 8:07am:
EDIT: BTW I love your post.  It reads as if English is your 3rd language behind gibberish and dipshit.


majmalphunktion wrote on Mar 20th, 2014 at 6:11pm:
what the fuck guys...

Jeesus fucking shit. This shit gets me called to the principals office.

Assholes.
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