AAH wrote on Oct 2
nd, 2020 at 2:19am:
I see points as a similar thing to gift cards*.
You may see points as similar to gift cards, SSG(and really every game using such a system) does not. Nor does the law recognize them as being "the same as gift cards". There's also a huge distinction between digital items and physical items. IE, mcdonalds dollars that can be exchanged for food vs. in-app points that can be exchanged for pretend digital goods.
AAH wrote on Oct 2
nd, 2020 at 2:19am:
If I buy a fridge using a gift card, does that fridge no longer have a cash value. Does it void the warranty and/or refund policy because it was purchased with a gift card.
So this is again where gift cards differ from DDO points. Depending on the store, you can usually buy something with a gift card, then return it for cash. Whether or not you can is a matter of store policy. Giftcard theft is also a serious issue. At weddings in particular its not at all uncommon for the happy couple to receive thousands of dollars in gift cards, which are usually all dropped into one bag for convenience... which someone else could walk off with. That's still considered grand theft even though *technically* the cards have no cash value.
Now, in your refrigerator example, the item isa physical thing that exists and is in your possession(being 9/10ths of the law), which means you can turn around and sell it to a third party for cash and the store you bought it from has no say.
This actually used to be a huge problem for online games(and still is in some *cough*EVE*cough). In the wild west days of Ultima Online and the original EverQuest, the concept of items being 'bound' hadn't been invented yet. This was great for the in-game economy since you could potentially buy the best item in the game with enough gold/platinum/cow nuts/whatever.
Alternatively, you could head over to eBay.com, where in 1999 a large house and 3 high level characters could be bought for about $400 USD. EverQuest raid loot? $50-60. You name it, there were actually categories on eBay for buying and selling MMO items. The game developers did not much care for this sort of thing for many reasons, and thus "bound to character" was invented.
That's also when ToSs started putting in things like "No cash value"
AAH wrote on Oct 2
nd, 2020 at 2:19am:
They say 'no cash value' knowing it would take a legal team and a load of money to challenge it. Not gonna happen.
You clicked "accept" on that ToS, would take some powerful lawyering to challenge that.
AAH wrote on Oct 2
nd, 2020 at 2:19am:
The thing is, if they said items purchased do have a cash value then the could actually kick some serious butt.
Well, no, they couldn't. Lol, ahhh... its a double-edged sword.
Let's say each otto's box is officially valued at $50. Its in the ToS(the imaginary one). So along comes a player who dupes 5,000 of them. Ok, SSG wants to sue them for $250,000. On that player is KNN, an unemployed looser living in a Puerto Rican slum. The court can say whatever they want, but there's no fucking way KNN is ever going to pay you that 250k. He is judgement-proof.
Let's play another hypothetical: Allice buys 10 ottos from the store for $500. Then bob comes along and hacks Allice's account! If the boxes are worth $500, then SSG now owes Allice $500.
How about an extreme example? Joe is a Saudi Prince who looooooooooves DDO and has functionally unlimited money(yes, this is a real thing, where do you think truly P2W games make their money?). Joe also really, really, really sucks at the game. So, Joe pulled out a fat stack of his oil money and bought 111 heroic boxes, 56 epic boxes, and 56 improved epic boxes to get all racial, iconic, and heroic past lives(ok my math is probably off but Joe isn't a very bright kid) 223 boxes @ $50 a box comes out to a bit over $11,000. Now lets say someone calls Joe a towelhead in game, he looses his shit, and gets banned. But since Joe has a ton of money, he can sue SSG for that $11,000 because the boxes have value.
That last one was a bit extreme, but lets play another(that has actually happened, though not to SSG). Little Timmy really wants to be powerful in DDO, so he sneaks into mom's purse and steals her credit card, maxes it out on boxes, eats all of them. (this exact scenario happens with cellphone games All. The. Fucking. Time.). Under the current ToS SSG is not obligated to refund the purchase because the points and anything bought with them have no cash value. If they change things so that they do, now SSG is reasonably on the hook for bad parenting.
All of these scenarios are much more likely than someone with the actual financial means to make restitution duping a bunch of ottos boxes. Those sorts of people don't dupe ottos boxes.
AAH wrote on Oct 2
nd, 2020 at 2:19am:
*In Australia a gift card effectively has no cash value unless it can be proven the card cannot be reasonably used. Such as me receiving a gift card for a female only gym.
So this is not eant as an attack or anything, I'm just curious about aussie-law. Lets say you bought a bunch of DDO points and then SSG banned your account. Would that constitute proof that the points cannot be reasonably used? This is interesting because if you can make the case that points do indeed "count" as giftcards than under applicable laws that opens up all sorts of interesting loopholes.