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Update 4.9 version 35849 (Read 13870 times)

Charon Ex Member	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #125 - Apr 23^rd, 2021 at 7:28pm	Print Post
	higgildypiggildy wrote on Apr 23^rd, 2021 at 4:38pm: I'm pretty sure that they are rolling 15d6. I'd really doubt it. Even they can't be that bad. I mean that's something so simple to optimize I doubt it would make it out of prototype as 15d6.


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Osharan Tregarth Horoluth Raider Offline I'm an ass... Deal with it. Posts: 2663 Location: Fresno Joined: Aug 23^rd, 2011 Gender:	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #126 - Apr 23^rd, 2021 at 10:13pm	Print Post
	Quote: I'd really doubt it. Even they can't be that bad. I mean that's something so simple to optimize I doubt it would make it out of prototype as 15d6. But if they were, it would explain so much...

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higgildypiggildy Stormreaver Piker Offline I just mock the world Posts: 660 Joined: Dec 8^th, 2011	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #127 - Apr 24^th, 2021 at 8:46am	Print Post
	15d6 is very different to 15-90. it's a bell curve vs a linear distribution produces very very different numbers. The chance of roll 90 on 15d6 = 0.16667 ^ 15 vs 1 in 75 15d6 will produce numbers from 40-64 most of the time (I can't be arsed to do the math for it, but most results will be within 2 standard deviations stuff like this) That's why you don't optimise to min-max because it produces very different results I remember something somehere saying that 6d6 produces enough variance that averaging the rest and adding it would cover you for 99% of all rolls of greater numbers of dice. I forget where that was, GURPS I think. It was all about reducing numbers of die rolled to make adding things up quicker stuff like that.

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Charon Ex Member	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #128 - Apr 24^th, 2021 at 10:02am	Print Post
	higgildypiggildy wrote on Apr 24^th, 2021 at 8:46am: 15d6 is very different to 15-90. it's a bell curve vs a linear distribution produces very very different numbers. The chance of roll 90 on 15d6 = 0.16667 ^ 15 vs 1 in 75 15d6 will produce numbers from 40-64 most of the time (I can't be arsed to do the math for it, but most results will be within 2 standard deviations stuff like this) That's why you don't optimise to min-max because it produces very different results I remember something somehere saying that 6d6 produces enough variance that averaging the rest and adding it would cover you for 99% of all rolls of greater numbers of dice. I forget where that was, GURPS I think. It was all about reducing numbers of die rolled to make adding things up quicker stuff like that. There's what's real in the real world and what you can fake with the computer. while I doubt they're calling randint(15,90); because they're adding some faking to it, I also doubt they're calling 15d6 either.


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5 Foot Step Completionist (i.t.p.) Offline I Hate Idiots! Posts: 11119 Location: USA Joined: Mar 8^th, 2014 Gender:	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #129 - Apr 24^th, 2021 at 10:21am	Print Post
	higgildypiggildy wrote on Apr 24^th, 2021 at 8:46am: 15d6 is very different to 15-90. it's a bell curve vs a linear distribution produces very very different numbers. The chance of roll 90 on 15d6 = 0.16667 ^ 15 vs 1 in 75 15d6 will produce numbers from 40-64 most of the time (I can't be arsed to do the math for it, but most results will be within 2 standard deviations stuff like this) That's why you don't optimise to min-max because it produces very different results I remember something somehere saying that 6d6 produces enough variance that averaging the rest and adding it would cover you for 99% of all rolls of greater numbers of dice. I forget where that was, GURPS I think. It was all about reducing numbers of die rolled to make adding things up quicker stuff like that. Obviously, they can weigh 15-90 without RNGing 1-6 15 times. Sorry I didn't make that clear.

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higgildypiggildy Stormreaver Piker Offline I just mock the world Posts: 660 Joined: Dec 8^th, 2011	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #130 - Apr 25^th, 2021 at 8:51am	Print Post
	It's easier and a lot more maintainable to do RandBetween(1, 6) 15 times and add them up than all these complicated "weighting" schemes you are coming up with. Spells with a (1d6) per level or say 3d8+((1 per level) (max add of 10)) etc. Coming up with a complicated weighting mechanism that scales across everything seems way harder than just rolling 1d6/level and adding it up. Remember the game was launched with what lvl 10 as max, so 10d6 was most they were doing. You would write something to deal with that stuff. As the game extends you keep using what works. But hey, you do you and keep on coming up with more and more complex scenarios and ways of generating random numbers. But it's pretty mad to do so. You might try optimising by generating bell curves for every type of damage and variant that can be rolled, then working out the % and rolling 1d100 (or probably 1d10000/100) to give the damage values, but hey that's a massively complex system with thousands of variants. Just for a weighted d6 you have 1D6, 1d5+1, 1d4+2, 1d3+3, 1d2+4. 1d1(1or0)+5. lets see, disintigrate is 40d6 @ 20, and there's a bunch of caster levels so , perhaps 60d6, generate lots of charts. Lots and lots. Then do it for all different kinds of dice.

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Charon Ex Member	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #131 - Apr 25^th, 2021 at 11:25am	Print Post
	higgildypiggildy wrote on Apr 25^th, 2021 at 8:51am: It's easier and a lot more maintainable to do RandBetween(1, 6) 15 times and add them up than all these complicated "weighting" schemes you are coming up with. Spells with a (1d6) per level or say 3d8+((1 per level) (max add of 10)) etc. Coming up with a complicated weighting mechanism that scales across everything seems way harder than just rolling 1d6/level and adding it up. Remember the game was launched with what lvl 10 as max, so 10d6 was most they were doing. You would write something to deal with that stuff. As the game extends you keep using what works. But hey, you do you and keep on coming up with more and more complex scenarios and ways of generating random numbers. But it's pretty mad to do so. You might try optimising by generating bell curves for every type of damage and variant that can be rolled, then working out the % and rolling 1d100 (or probably 1d10000/100) to give the damage values, but hey that's a massively complex system with thousands of variants. Just for a weighted d6 you have 1D6, 1d5+1, 1d4+2, 1d3+3, 1d2+4. 1d1(1or0)+5. lets see, disintigrate is 40d6 @ 20, and there's a bunch of caster levels so , perhaps 60d6, generate lots of charts. Lots and lots. Then do it for all different kinds of dice. The thing is that back then we had less processor. Remember, when the game launched a P4 was top of the line. Our cpus could probably take 15d6 today, back in the p4 era, I'm less confident. Back then you really did need to hack more things to fake functionality in an optimized way to stay within system resources.


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Shinyshoes Abbot Raider Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 754 Joined: Mar 8^th, 2019	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #132 - Apr 29^th, 2021 at 8:51pm	Print Post
	So I googled and found this https://stormflaggames.com/team I am disappointed that the U49 solving of lag forever hasn't yet been added to anyone's bio. And how long till Jerry comes on board as an advisor. Surely with so many, there is a place for him to hide.


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Prostetnic Vogon Jeltz Stormreaver Piker Offline I Love Poetry! Posts: 605 Location: Section ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha Joined: Jun 21^st, 2020	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #133 - Apr 30^th, 2021 at 5:56am	Print Post
	Shinyshoes wrote on Apr 29^th, 2021 at 8:51pm: So I googled and found this https://stormflaggames.com/team I am disappointed that the U49 solving of lag forever hasn't yet been added to anyone's bio. And how long till Jerry comes on board as an advisor. Surely with so many, there is a place for him to hide. Holy Baby Buhjeebers Batman! That’s like everybody that Turbine fired from 2013 thru 2017!


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Shunned Stormreaver Piker Offline Hi! You have multiple personality disorder. Posts: 528 Location: Behind the edit button Joined: Nov 21^st, 2020	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #134 - Apr 30^th, 2021 at 6:26am	Print Post
	ricardo-liu is the hyperlinked linked in when you click on Michael Kujawa name on that web page. dude got two names?


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Nub Korthos Resident Offline Posts: 95 Joined: Feb 25^th, 2012	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #135 - Apr 30^th, 2021 at 6:45am	Print Post
	[quote author=704B4A4D5A504B4C4650230 link=1618342931/132#132 date=1619743893]So I googled and found this https://stormflaggames.com/team /quote] Look at these people with their "quality assurance" and "player retention"


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SpaceGoat Stormreaver Piker Offline I Love Drama! Posts: 600 Joined: Oct 14^th, 2015	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #136 - Apr 30^th, 2021 at 9:53am	Print Post
	higgildypiggildy wrote on Apr 25^th, 2021 at 8:51am: It's easier and a lot more maintainable to do RandBetween(1, 6) 15 times and add them up than all these complicated "weighting" schemes you are coming up with. Spells with a (1d6) per level or say 3d8+((1 per level) (max add of 10)) etc. Coming up with a complicated weighting mechanism that scales across everything seems way harder than just rolling 1d6/level and adding it up. Remember the game was launched with what lvl 10 as max, so 10d6 was most they were doing. You would write something to deal with that stuff. As the game extends you keep using what works. But hey, you do you and keep on coming up with more and more complex scenarios and ways of generating random numbers. But it's pretty mad to do so. You might try optimising by generating bell curves for every type of damage and variant that can be rolled, then working out the % and rolling 1d100 (or probably 1d10000/100) to give the damage values, but hey that's a massively complex system with thousands of variants. Just for a weighted d6 you have 1D6, 1d5+1, 1d4+2, 1d3+3, 1d2+4. 1d1(1or0)+5. lets see, disintigrate is 40d6 @ 20, and there's a bunch of caster levels so , perhaps 60d6, generate lots of charts. Lots and lots. Then do it for all different kinds of dice. interesting insight


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Technomage Epic Poster Offline And so it begins... Posts: 4444 Location: Tucson, AZ Joined: Aug 27^th, 2015 Gender:	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #137 - Apr 30^th, 2021 at 10:39am	Print Post
	Shunned wrote on Apr 30^th, 2021 at 6:26am: ricardo-liu is the hyperlinked linked in when you click on Michael Kujawa name on that web page. dude got two names? If you look at his Linked In profile, it looks like he hasn't been with Storm Flag Games for almost 3 years!

	Do not try the patience of wizards, for they are subtle and quick to anger. We are dreamers, shapers, singers, and makers. We study the mysteries of laser and circuit, crystal and scanner, holographic demons and invocation of equations. These are the tools we employ, and we know many things. The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
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Dragonborn Shroud Slacker Offline Savaging the masses... one dumbfuck at a time Posts: 1243 Joined: Jul 25^th, 2020	Re: Update 4.9 version 35849 Reply #138 - Apr 30^th, 2021 at 5:16pm	Print Post
	Stormflag games, we may not be able to create our own games but we can surely fuck up yours.

	noamineo wrote on Dec 24^th, 2021 at 12:04pm: Sadly only scammers are "selling" boxes now. But if you do want to get scammed, I know a guy. OSeanessy wrote on Dec 26^th, 2021 at 6:03am: Just for the record, I bought ten stones from Dragonborn a few days back. Fair and civil trade which went smoothly
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