Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 Send TopicPrint
Normal Topic DDO and Isaac Azimov (Read 1400 times)
noamineo
Completionist (i.t.p.)
******
Offline


All men fear time, but
time fears the pyramids

Posts: 8996
Location: Titan
Joined: Jul 2nd, 2014
DDO and Isaac Azimov
Apr 16th, 2022 at 7:21am
Print Post  
I found myself today playing with a hireling for the first time in recent memory. As always happens, I was reminded how unrelentingly shitty they are. Watching Heystack stare at my with 7 health and neither of his heal abilities on cooldown made me angry.

It occurred to me that, had SSG programmed the hirelings to be three-laws compliant, they wouldn't be nearly as bad. For those of you unawares, it would go something like this:

A hireling may not injure a player or, through inaction, allow a player to come to harm.

A hireling must obey the orders given it by a player except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.

A hireling must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.



Think about your experiences with Klin Stegan and tell me that wouldn't improve it.

Unfortunately DDO hirelings appear to comply to the One Law of SSG AI:

Be retarded.
  

I'll never understand the propensity of people to brag about being good at a video game. Its a toy you play with for fun. The only person who should be proud of you is your mother. If you're 3.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Shinyshoes
Abbot Raider
**
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 754
Joined: Mar 8th, 2019
Re: DDO and Isaac Azimov
Reply #1 - Apr 16th, 2022 at 8:09pm
Print Post  
My favourite is when you park the in a corner on passive, invisi them, then use the for a heal and then they run forward to attack. Of course they are on passive so die faster than the weapon swap cooldown.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kum-gulp
VoD Slasher
*****
Offline


I Love Tired Vault Memes!

Posts: 1810
Joined: Jul 16th, 2010
Re: DDO and Isaac Azimov
Reply #2 - Apr 17th, 2022 at 6:02am
Print Post  
Maybe this has changed but I used a hireline once - long enough to learn it'd cost me 5% XP - and realised I'd be better off without.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
bob the builder
Abbot Raider
**
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 772
Joined: Apr 19th, 2011
Re: DDO and Isaac Azimov
Reply #3 - Apr 17th, 2022 at 8:44am
Print Post  
Hireling deaths' don't hurt your xp
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kum-gulp
VoD Slasher
*****
Offline


I Love Tired Vault Memes!

Posts: 1810
Joined: Jul 16th, 2010
Re: DDO and Isaac Azimov
Reply #4 - Apr 17th, 2022 at 11:25am
Print Post  
Well fuck my tits. Off to the wiki to see if it was ever like that or if I was hallucinating. Could've sworn they used to rob you of the no death bonus by 5% (less than a player?) if they snuffed it.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kum-gulp
VoD Slasher
*****
Offline


I Love Tired Vault Memes!

Posts: 1810
Joined: Jul 16th, 2010
Re: DDO and Isaac Azimov
Reply #5 - Apr 17th, 2022 at 11:35am
Print Post  
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ManyCookies
Titan Demolisher
****
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 360
Joined: Nov 16th, 2018
Re: DDO and Isaac Azimov
Reply #6 - Apr 18th, 2022 at 12:05am
Print Post  
I think hires only check every X seconds whether to heal you or not. Toggling them between active and passive resets the check, so they will immediately start healing if the conditions are met.

In general, hires in heroic work fine for me, but you need enough dps and damage mitigation to last long enough for them to heal you. If you are in a situation where theres too much incoming damage, the hires may not react fast enough to heal you.

With 3x druid past lives, i find larafay better for 15+ personally, because she can cast greater command which actually works a decent amount of time. Just make sure to turn off destruction/cometfall or she will burn through SP like crazy.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Anothersock
Dragon Raider
***
Offline


I Love Drama!

Posts: 217
Joined: Mar 28th, 2022
Re: DDO and Isaac Azimov
Reply #7 - Apr 18th, 2022 at 5:18am
Print Post  
Quote:
hires only check every X seconds whether to heal you or not

You'd think so, even from an AI development point of view. But that also assumes a modicum or competence during development. Turdbine never had anyone decent working on this or lotro, let alone anyone competent!

You'd also think that in later years after several sales and flag changes they'd actually hire someone competent to fix their mistakes? But of course not, they have basically been caught recycling the same people over and over.
(It's also probably why Fatsovan still has a job after all this time of doing jack shit and pestering the forums with trash...)

The hirelings rely on a navmesh to work. Most of the time the navmesh in the game is as basic as it gets. That's not necessarily a bad thing, mind you. The way the hirelings *use* said mesh - their movement algorhytm is what's completely fucked up.
It's just lacking basic rules to obviate issues.

For one, the hires know there's traps. Instead of running after you, if they know there's a trap they should probably stop and not dash through it - mind you that most of that is in place.
Telling a hireling to open a chest or pull a lever that they know is trapped usually had (in past times, not sure now?) them flat out refusing to.

For 2, their heal/combat algorhythm is all over the place. You have them falling below 50% health in guard mode and not heal themselves.
You have them resurrect with 10% hp and not heal them self at all, let alone immidiately.
You have them in active mode and they won't even bother healing anything (which sort of makes sense, they should still heal themselves if below 50% though).

You have them unable to find same level EE traps - their search skill is 0 or something.

You have the fighter healing himself more than FVS/Paladin. Which is rediculous considering in reaper mode they have to chug 2 inventories of pots to keep up (And I do think they run out).

On the cool side of things, you can could kill them over and over to the point they end up naked (Not sure they still can).

Basically they have a setup and functionality that seems to mirror players - which makes perfect sense on a developer standpoint.
You don't need special classes, you can just instantiate a "character" with specific stats/values, same as everyone else.
The bad part of this is that turdbine was incapable of leveling their own toons properly, obviously, so I'm sure that most of the hires end up with massive penalties and issues. Come think of it, it's probably why rouges have no search...

Another thing worth bringing up is the fact that the hires have as many spells as the equivalent classes would - you just don't have direct access to them.
Some times, they appear to throw some extra spells around. Like nimbus of light, or even the occasional mass cure.
If they actually standardized all their spells and let them actually use them, there would almost never be a moment in which they have a healing spell on cooldown by level 11.

But again. You would need half competent developers instead of brain dead fuckwads who tell you the math of the new shiradi nerf and can't be bothered trying to acrually solve it to notice the fact its a lot lower than they claim.
The only hope is that SSG declares bankruptcy and someone who actually fires the whole fucking staff buys up the IP/source/servers.
We aren't that far off from this Smiley
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1
Send TopicPrint